controller separates debate

LET’S ARGUE: People would prefer separates to controllers

Imagine the situation — it’s a sunny day in the rural idyl where the Worxlab is situated. The desire to do actual work is at an all-time low, and the draw of the local coffee shop (also my landlord) is higher than ever. Giving in to temptation, Dan and myself duly locked up, sat in the sunshine and hoped to get inspiration in the bottom of a coffee cup.

LET'S ARGUE: People would prefer separates to controllers
Empty coffee cups courtesy of Cobbles and Clay, Haworth.

We bounced around many subjects, none of which were especially DJ related. But we did eventually get into quite a humdinger of a lively outdoor DJ debate, that after finishing our respective latte and cappuccino thought would be an ideal discussion to extend to our excellent community.

So here’s the thrust of the debate:

If there were no financial or logistical constraints, people would generally buy a turntable/CDJ and mixer setup in preference to an all-in-one controller. 

This is Dan’s stance. I however strongly disagree with this sentiment. So in true debate style, we’re putting our cases forward, and then leave it to you to post your own thoughts.

A video of our face-off would have been more entertaining. Seeing grown men argue about DJ stuff while drinking coffee on a tourist-filled cobbled street would have made for great content. But arguments happen spontaneously, and we’re not quite famous enough to be followed around by a film crew for our non-existent reality TV show. So this will just have to do.

LET'S ARGUE: People would prefer separates to controllers

Dan’s take

Yes, with zero constraints, DJs would overwhelmingly prefer to own separate DJ units over an all-in-one controller.

It’s important to state that I do say ‘mostly’. There’s always going to be the outliers (right, Mark?), but in my experience, people would rather own any sort of turntable or media player along with a mixer, than a MIDI controller. You can argue you have a controller for X/Y/Z, but those are just reasons for ownership, not how you feel.

It’s not just about money that people go for all-in-one controller, either. Whether due to space, logistics, children, or ease of setting up, convenience isn’t a choice as more of a forced decision. People settle on an all-in-one because it’s what they can fit into their life. There’s a huge difference between hating the equipment you own and desiring the idea of separate units.

People around the world love playing on their controllers, but the reality is that all-in-ones are – and will continue to be – seen as toys. Whether the beasts like the TRAKTOR S8 or the DDJ-RZX, or the trusty affordable Mixtrack Pro, they just aren’t aspirational. Separate DJ gear is, because that’s where the mystique is. Where the history of DJing is. Where the professionals are.

Even when a famous DJ like Carl Cox is seen using a controller, they inevitably end up back on CDJs, or a more modular setup with a club mixer in the middle. The Paris Hilton thing really doesn’t help, either. The easiest way to tank sentiment in a concept is to attach it to something negative, and that’s especially true in such a passionate scene as ours.

I wrote not too long ago about my distrust of mixers with built-in audio interfaces, and I think there’s also a similar sentiment towards controllers. With separate gear, you can upgrade parts as you need or want to, whereas a controller is take-it-or-leave-it. Something breaks? Replace everything! New model comes out? Sell everything (for a big loss)! But that’s a story for another day, I think?

And I’m not shitting on all-in-ones from a personal opinion. I can have just as much fun on the S8 as I could with DVS (just a different kind of experience). Some of my closes friends have all-in-one controllers. They’re still cool people.

LET'S ARGUE: People would prefer separates to controllers

MARK’S TAKE

People buy controllers for a lot of reasons. But my genuine belief is that the majority do so because they want an all-in-one unit, and do not hanker for a larger separates based setup.

Why? Convenience and features. It’s one off-the-shelf box, with one power cable, a USB cable and no audio cables bar hooking up to the sound system. It’s compact, generally cheap for what you get, and just works. On the whole they do everything most DJs want and more in a single easy to use box. They often do more too than a separates setup — just look at the plethora of extra features that are included as standard, and the ones you can add with just software.

Controller buyers have a huge choice of options open to them. Right now, they can grab a complete Pioneer DJ DVS setup for £899, or a CDJ setup for £1399 — just add a laptop. But they don’t. Why buy a bunch of individual units when you have more for less in one single box?

I largely leave cost out of this because if DJs want costly setups, they always find the money somehow. It’s my belief that if DJs want CDJs or turntables, they’ll save up and buy them. But I feel that most will look at a complete separates setup and realise that a controller will do exactly what they want.

I do get all the reasons for buying turntables and mixers over an all-in-one. But it is my contention is that most DJs who buy controllers do so because they want controllers, and not because they’re a cheap version of #realdjing, or that they can’t afford separates. For them, it’s deliberate and not a make-do measure.

controller separates debate

OVER TO YOU

Just so you know, we wrote our pieces independently, and haven’t altered anything after sight of each other’s opinions. I’m sure we’ll expand on our thoughts as the comments come in too.

So controller owners — would you actually prefer turntables, CDJs, and a mixer? Or did you buy a controller because that’s what you really wanted to buy in the first place?

The Old Owner
  1. Separate units ftw!

    That doesn’t just count for controllers vs traditional hardware – though I’d always prefer a decent mixer over a midi unit.
    I’d rather hook up my ancient VCM-100 (if only they built a 4ch version) to the D2’s than buy an S8 instead.

    For me, the major argument towards all-in-ones (or units like the D2) always has been their technological superiority over CDJs (hardcore expensive late 2000’s technology!).
    The Denon DJ SC5000 might change that, if it ever will be released.

  2. I am now into my 26th year in this game, ooft.. Definitely on the side of a modular setup vs an all in one. One of the venues I play at has terrible power issues, every all in one controller I have tried has frozen or locked up whereas my trusty timecode setup is quite happy. Add to this playing on real turntables is more enjoyable, looks better from a customer point of view and I can upgrade whenever I like. For gigs where I need to setup quickly, I have a flightcase all wired up with a pair of Denon SC2000s and a Mastersounds radius 2 in the middle all based around a Traktor setup. I have peace of mind if something goes wrong with my backup iPad on standby and it sounds way better than any all in one controller I have used. For home I have my 1210s in my living room and can’t say that will ever change, I had a Traktor s4 and then a numark NV for a while but they were just dull.

  3. Separate units – especially for swapping out DJ mixers, I’d much rather use something cool for mixing sound (A+H xone 92, rotaries, etc) – and the ability to swap out the “decks” – I avoided the dreaded vinyl is the only way syndrome a lot of older DJs got trapped with, and I’m loving experimenting – I have 2 denon sc3700s controlling traktor in a 4 deck control custom midi mapping, but I’m looking forward to trying out some A+H K2s, I’d like to try out the pioneer XDJs and even cop some ancient Denon SC2000s to give them a go. Modular for the win!

    PS – I started my digital journey with a mixtrack Pro 3 and I regret selling it – perfect for doing little corporate events or small shin digs!

    PPS – Traktor screwed up trying to lock people into their devices, the more variety and options the better!

  4. To be clear — my stance is that people who buy controllers largely do so as their first choice. I’m not against separates at all — quite the contrary, but I don’t think all-in-ones are a second choice for people who buy them. The principle that all-in-one controller owners are somehow settling for second best is utter tosh to me.

    1. totally agreed, I would love to hear from all in one owners about the following: what happens when their software and/or OS is outdated and drivers die? I purchased a Denon x1600 brand new when they were deadstock – while it’s a fantastic and versatile mixer, the audio interface portion of it will be quite dead once my mac dies and I cannot use El Capitan anymore on MAC OS – thats the biggest risk to me and why I’m a proponent of modular. I wish I had purchased a Elcer Nuo 4 or Xone and a seperate audio interface. With all in one controllers, cheap ones probably dont matter but if you spend $1500 and get stuck with software/OS upgrade issues?

        1. There are also people all over the world that develop a driver for their own use and then release to see if others could derive enjoyment from them.. This will only get better as more and more people learn fundamental programming skills at a basic level.

          There was once a point when people had to consider.. installing mouse drivers..

          1. Just how many dj’s do you think are also developers?
            I’d hardly call updating mixer firmware / core audio drivers some thing you can do with “fundamental” programming skills.

            You’re gonna need to know a low level language like C or C++ to do any of this.
            Most developers write python, php, or javascript.

            Updating drivers is beyond the scope of most dj’s who also develop.

            1. How many I think there are or aren’t is irrelevant.
              No.. you can’t easily do those things with just the fundamentals of programming.. You sure as shit can’t do it without them though. :)

              I don’t know how to say this without sounding like an ass.. But that happens regardless..

              Something like C is the bare minimum requirement for me to consider somebody a programmer.. Granted.. My bias was created through searching for and getting demoscene creations to work on my computer.. To me.. Real programmers a class apart.

              DJs who also develop aren’t going to be doing the work..
              Programmers who also DJ are however..

              1. The future is the web,
                The Web Browser is the New OS
                Javascript is the programming language of the web.

                The Node.js code i write on a daily basis isn’t programming???
                Even though the code base is over 100,000 lines?

                and you call me elitist?
                you just #RealDjing’ed with code.

                I don’t think you actually write code for a living. You don’t seem to know how any of this works.

                1. Bruh.. Do you even compile? Javascript.. is a.. wait for it.. Scripting language.. I wish I could pat you on the back and say.. “Dude.. you are totally in the same league as the people I looked up to as a teenager.” But I can’t..

                  No.. I don’t write it.. My experience has given me a really really good foundation to judge it from though.. Did I call you Elitist?

                  I’m not even going to quote or try to retype what I said.. It’s already there.. If you have programmers envy because you can’t write C or another low level actual programming language.. That’s your man feels bruh.. Not my concern…

                  If you do know how to write C.. What the fuck are you even pissing and moaning about?

                  The web browser is the new OS.. My butt it is.. I think you have me confused with somebody who in fact doesn’t know a thing about the field.. No, I don’t know how to code.. I have discalculia and very small math buffers..

                  That said.. I am the person that knows how to give detailed and pertinent answers to developers with beta software and hardware.. I’m the person that doesn’t bring a developer an issue unless I have recreated it a number of times and know specifically when it will come out..

                  Don’t throw lines of code at me like it’s some sort of metric I should fucking be impressed with.. I don’t know what your project is.. I can’t make a judgement on whether your javascript is lean, elegant, and well commented because I have no knowledge of the nature of its purpose…

                  I think.. You’re too lazy or up your own ass to fix your computer or work around the issue..

                  Sorry Dude.. Go learn C and take a computer repair class or something.. Not impressed with your sob story.

          2. As someone who is an actual software developer…

            Can you please provide a real-life case example of a hobbyist programmer creating unofficial drivers for a piece of discontinued DJ/production hardware?

            If you can provide one, I’ll be genuinely surprised, since I’ve never seen or heard of such a thing happening. Manufacturers are not very keen to disclose proprietary schematics, firmware source code etc. that would usually be required to create working drivers.

            1. No.. Go find a readily available example outside of the DJ hardware/software paradigm like a rational person… Can you provide me with the name of a piece of software you have created so I can be suitably impressed by “actual software developer”

              If you can prove to me beyond a shadow of a doubt that hardware hackers do not exist and the technology required to brute force the fuck out of it doesn’t exist.. I’ll be genuinely surprised..

              I had a tangential question for you btw.. Are the tits on your website based on your own tits? Or..is that like.. just marketing shit? Do you regularly feature female DJs? Or just fond of objectifying them for more business?

                1. and you’re clearly a chauvinist piece of shit that objectifies women for advertisement for their shitty website.. So.. I look at your background.. and call out obvious bullshit on your publicly available social media and that makes me unstable? Do you live in North Carolina?

                  Do you believe it is rational.. or necessary to run over people who are demonstrating in order to secure their rights?

                  To me.. driving over people.. who are in your way.. instead of.. communicating with them.. is unstable..

                  Calling out your bullshit on another website is just calling out your bullshit.. It sounds to me as if you believe that there should be no crossing of the streams…

                  You think that shitty behaviour one place should be confined to that place..

                  You do this in order to insulate yourself from criticism..

                  To everybody else.. you can easily find out what this is in reference to (unless they delete the tweet) on their twitter page..

                  auralcandy.net is actually proposing that you should run over people with your car if they are being politically active and they get in your way..

                  auralcandy.net is literally promoting homicide of people who are fighting for their rights..

                  auralcandy.net is based out of finland.

                  I don’t have to screenshot shit and go “nyah nyah everybody! look! this person is totally crazy!”
                  I have the fucking moxie to respond to people myself..

                  auralcandy.net If you have a problem with me.. Respond to me.. fucking pansy.

                  P.S.. You might as well block me here as well if you can’t actually respond to me like an adult..

                  You’re an emotional and mental coward.. and I’d rather be unstable than a cowardly tattletale..

                  :)

                2. P.S. You are clearly somebody who ignores everything going on around them except for that which strokes your own ego.. and everything that doesn’t stroke your ego.. is so much white noise around you..

                  It doesn’t take a genius buddy… You could have asked ANYBODY and they likely would have told you that I would return every ounce of catty bullshit you brought to me.. A cursory fucking internet search would have to you that I will fucking rant at you all day and all night if you gave me a reason to..

                  You’re very late to the party.. and your petty pissy little screenshot.. Gives me nothing but glee.

                  Just because you’re oblivious to everything except that which is blowing you.. Doesn’t mean everyone else is..

                  Still waiting for the name of a piece of software you develop that I should give a shit about.. I imagine I’ll be waiting til I’m dead…

                  Because you haven’t got shit.

                3. I still haven’t received any answer btw.. and beyond your one direct reply to me.. you haven’t said anything.

                  Are they your tits on your logo? DO you regularly promote female DJs? Is your logo.. LITERALLY just objectification of women?

      1. I’m not sure what exactly you are saying is the problem.

        What are these “software/OS upgrade” issues you speak of?

        very few things “kill” computers.. they aren’t biological.. a mainboard death is often just that. Drivers.. can be finessed.. and Operating Systems can be configured to use drivers in different configurations..

        My questions to you are… Have you been told outright there are no Sierra drivers? Have you attempted any finessing of drivers on a test system that has Sierra?

        I have a decade old M-Audio Connectiv that I have no reasonable right to expect functionality from.. but it does work.. because its so old..

        1. Computers die (this is a fact of life), and when they do, your 1500 dollar lump of shiny dies too.

          Let’s say you have a late 2011 macbook pro 15 inch (a very popular machine which still runs VERY quickly with an ssd, i’m typing this on one). There is a very widely known graphics card issue for these machines that will completely brick your computer, and the apple repair program for it ended in december. If you have a DN X1600 (which I also do), and your computer dies, if you decide to buy a new mac you’re SOL, because you can’t load El Cap or Mavericks on a new mac. And denon cut support for ALL of their mixers, they only work up to el cap.

          You only have 3 options, buy a used machine (alot of people don’t like used), buy a windows machine (alot of people can’t stand windows), or buy a new mixer (I just bought a Xone DB4). None of these is ideal, especially if all you want to do is use a piece of kit that you’ve already spent much money on / love to death.

          Another aside, I have an M-Audio Conectiv as well, works fine on my windows partition, doesn’t work at all on my mac partition.

          All that said, I my prefered setup is 2 tt’s, a midi capable mixer with an interface IN IT, and some auxiliary controllers to handle all my other functionality, hanging right above my mixer (currently 2 amx’s, possibly 2 d2’s in the future ). I want to plug as little into my computer as possible and get the most functionality. I always bring my own gear to gigs, so the less wires and cables, the better.

          I’d seem like a prime candidate for an all in one, given my distaste for cables, but there’s something about tt’s that keeps me away. Had a go on an ns7, and though mixing on it felt incredibly similar to tt’s, 7 inches just isn’t 12 inches.

          1. Your bias is very prominent.. That box you are in looks very small.. You might want to step outside of it.. By the time any.. and I mean.. any of this.. becomes relevant to me.. personally.. I will have done a data recovery on a machine that will be given to me in exchange for the work of the recovery.. Distaste of using windows.. to DJ.. is honestly kind of elitist.. I bought my mac mini 2012 specifically because of the kinds of issues you are talking about.. She still runs like a champ..

            Take your “brick” of shiny.. to china.. tell them a sad story about how you lost your investment.. See if they sympathize with you while they are doing micro soldering on an iphone they brought back from the dead..

            In other words.. I’m not really sympathetic to “I can’t use my mixer because my operating system is too new and I won’t configure a capable windows machine to run my DJing software from.

            I have my copy of Traktor on two different platforms.. and one is a dell with a failing keyboard and mouse.. neither of which I need to DJ.

            If you love your mixer that much.. Love it enough to buy it its own computer..

            I honestly don’t think it will happen.. but if Native instruments said “Sorry Z2 owners, your burnt” I’d just move the laptop from where its sitting as a print server and hook it up on the other side of my mixer from my mini.

            As far as your connectiv on mac issue goes.. That’s weird.. It makes me want to unplug it from my girlfriends mini and into mine.. because she’s on sierra.. no drivers installed.. just works.. and I’m on sierra as well.

            My point is.. While other people were getting regular gigs.. I was honing my tech skills. While other people updated their machine just because.. I was likely using my old toshiba and an extremely early copy of deckadance..

            So no.. I really have no idea what you mean by “computers die”. I’ve never been financially comfortable enough for that to be an excuse to me.

            1. the point was an analogue mixer with a separate soundcard input – cheaper to swap out a soundcard to ensure software driver versioning than a mixer with a built in soundcard. Essentially if I upgrade from my Mac Mini running El Capitan, my Denon x1600 is now an analogue mixer that requires a seperate soundcard.

            2. Your head is in your own ass, so you miss the point entirely.

              While I admire you’re “get it out of the mud” attitude, it’s not exactly realistic, is it? NOBODY is writing custom firmware. It’s not happening.

              I only own ONE computer. I’ve owned this computer since 2011. I don’t have aging print servers or dells with failing keyboards. I have the one macbook. i bought it after saving for 2 years working at a grocery store. I’m not, and have never been, rich.

              In the end, I don’t want or need your sympathy. I had a problem and Denon wouldn’t fix it. So I dealt with the headache of shutting down and switching to windows for a while, then I bought a new mixer. It’s how capitalism works.

              If you’re half as good a C “programmer” as you claim to be, you should move to America. You’ll make 100 + thousand a year, and you won’t have to use your intel d820 machine’s anymore.

              1. Buddy.. I never claimed to be a C programmer.. That was your failure to understand context.. I said that’s the minimum of where I considered a person an actual programmer..

                Somebody that knows a programming language.. that requires compiling for binaries.. If you write javascript for a living.. Good for you.. but I’m sorry.. I wouldn’t consider you a programmer.

                There is no shame in being a javascript developer.. But no.. scripting and mark up languages hold no mystery to me.. therefore.. I’m just not really impressed with people comparing web platforms to compiled binaries..

                Who… said anything about custom firmware? There is firmware on the beta tabletop CD decks I was given.. I’m speaking about.. drivers.. and drivers.. can always be considered stable in scenarios where the computer they are run from is sufficiently aged..

                I live in the states.. In the pacific northwest in fact.. one of the states more popular areas for programming considering microsoft, amazon, etc etc.. but like I said before.. I can’t code.. I’d like to learn skills that allowed me get over my issues.. (numbers turn to mush, one number comes in my head, the previous one disappears) But it takes all kinds.. I have contributed to the improvement of a number of pieces of software over the years.

                I’m sorry the region you are in doesn’t have the same used hardware economy.. That’s definitely unfortunate.. What I am saying is keep your eyes out for used hardware that you know will run the equipment you want to run.. It’s not impossible to get a hold of.. nor is computer equipment very hard to maintain..

                Here’s a piece of advice I will give you.. For your next computer.. Look for a Mac Mini 2012 i7.. They are a secret gem.. well. maybe not so secret.. Anyhow.. User upgradeable to two internal drives… (SSD is a popular option) and user upgradeable to 16gb of ram. and if the computer bites the bullet.. It’s possible to find a replacement mainboard..

                I know how capitalism works.. I just don’t allow it to affect me much anymore.. Granted.. The load time for my lifestyle was minimum 15 years of a lot of front end bullshit.. But I have sufficient amounts of time and equipment to follow my own bliss now..

                1. You’ve got a pretty hard set opinion of what a programmer is, for someone who doesn’t write code. You’ve also got some pretty hard set opinions on what a dj should be able to do with his mixers firmware / core audio drivers, again for some who doesn’t write code. Your opinion is the equivalent of a non-dj saying what a “real dj” is.

                  Maybe you should look into what javascript does nowadays. Node is incredibly powerful. You can use it to write native applications (using React Native / Cordova / Phonegap ) or for writing desktop applications (using electron and its derivatives). You can also build incredibly powerful web apps with it (like disqus, the comment app we’re currently communicating on). If you write an entire application in javascript (like the facebook messenger app), and millions of people use it, are you not a programmer? To say that low level programming is the only “real” programming is daft at best, ignorant at worst.

                  C++ was my first language. I write javascript because there’s way more jobs out there for js Dev’s than there are for c / c++ dev’s. It’s also evolving at an unbelievable rate, so it doesn’t get boring like writing c derivatives does (IMO). The difference between a programmer and a guy who uses code to make stuff is the ability to write business logic. If you can write performant Business Logic, IDK if you use PHP / Ruby / C / Swift / or Assembly. You are a programmer. Much in the same way, if you play music to people in a continuous fashion, you are a dj .

                  bad_opinion = (uninformed_guy)=>{
                  return (
                  this.setState(you:roasted)
                  )
                  };

                  1. “C++ was my first language.”

                    Then I literally don’t know what you are bitching about.. Like seriously.. You’re bitching at me like I said “javascript developers son’t know how to code”.

                    Find the context.. read what I actually wrote.. and stop being butthurt that I don’t think you are something that you just said.. You are..

                    If you know how to program in C++, You are a fucking programmer.. Stop pissing and moaning that I don’t think that every joe shmoe who can toss out a php, python, or a javascript function is a fucking programmer..

                    In fact.. Stop bitching that somebody that looks up to programmers has an arbitrary fucking requirement that doesn’t affect their life..

                    Fucks sake.. No… I really don’t think something that I could repair if given a look at the pre minified script is as involved as remembering compiler settings and trying to compile for different platforms..

                    For a fucking programmer you are shit at parsing a block of text.. Go fuck yourself buddy.. I never said any DJ should be able to do X. I implied that there will be people who will find a way given enough time and having enough initiative..

                    YES. My opinion of what a programmer is IS biased by my history and my experiences..

                    WHAT IN THE FUCK DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE TO YOU IF YOU MAKE A LIVING WRITING JAVASCRIPT?

                    Yeah. I might fucking use the API you work on.. if wishes were horses and pigs regularly flew out of peoples asses.. Or if anybody.. ever.. once.. fucking valued the skills I do have.

                    Bye dude.. seriously done with your whining about an issue you could do something about yourself if you fucking tried hard enough and your goddamn techno insecurity based on the opinions of people who don’t make a living in the industry.. Fucks sake.. have some respect for yourself.

                    1. Look man, I write javascript to feed myself. I’m not rich. Disrespecting the language I write in is like disrespecting my lively hood. Telling me what I do for a living “isn’t programming”, is disrespectful to me as a man.

                      This got out of hand.
                      I mean you no disrespect personally, even if you don’t write code.
                      I’m sure you’re valuable to the tech community anyhow.

      2. Am i missing the point? Your x1600 is still a standalone mixer. You can get an external soundcard for it if and when El Capitan no longer works.

    2. I’d say no one would buy all-in-ones (except maybe mobile DJs) if they were sold at the same price as a setup of separate units. Especially Pioneer DJ did a great job selling controllers that look and feel similar to the CDJ/DJM stuff at a fraction of the cost. So if everyone would have the financial resources, few all-in-ones would be sold.

      1. Selling this gear at the same price is never going to happen though. Nobody would buy a controller for the same price as a NXS2 setup. The restrictions being discussed are more about the buyer — removing financial and other restrictions from them. My point still stands — people buy controllers as a first choice, and not as a second best substitute for separates.

        1. Nobody would buy a controller for the same price as a NXS2 setup.

          That’s what I’m saying. People buy all-in-ones because they’re considerably cheaper than separate gear – not because they want an all-in-one in the first place.

  5. Separate units are the best, until you need to move them. If I was famous and had roadies to set my stuff up for me, that’s all I’d use. They always seem to have the best feel. But I’m not famous so I have to shlep all my gear myself, so a controller is best for me. I’m not sure I’ll ever use my turntables outside of my house again. They’re nice to have, but not necessary.

  6. I gotta agree with Dan here.. Money and space no object.. I would get separates for everything.. Then again.. that’s basically what I have done any way. I still haven’t been able to afford a single nice deck.. but when I get one it will look fantastic next to all my other equipment..

    There is a lot to be said about an all in one.. namely a uniformity of design.. But the major components of a setup usually fit within a certain form factor.. a tabletop dj mixer is usually about the height of a turntable..

    Given Mark’s clarification, I think I would have to agree.. I learned on two turntables and an installed mixer so that is where my comfort lies. That said.. I have a friend who uses and presumably learned on an S2. I mentioned he might want to load the Z2 drivers on his computer for simplification during switching and he implied he wouldn’t be comfortable.. on a full mixer.. that lacked nothing he was using on his own controller.

    Basically.. if he is similar to other users that learned on controllers.. Controller users don’t really want to learn how to use something they don’t get to use often in the first place.. He’s fine on his controller.. But if his controller broke and there were no replacements around.. He’d be fucked..

    Me on the other hand.. I will use whatever is available and gives me the most options.. plus.. It’s nice to have.. You know… an actual mixer.. as the center of your setup..

  7. Occam’s razor. I think it is simply a matter of convenience and saving your back. For the same reason people would choose a laptop or USB sticks and leave the vinyl at home, they will leave the separates at home if they have to bring their entire DJ rig to every single gig.

    I think if you are playing clubs and festivals where they have equipment to play on already for you when you walk in the door, the convenience and workflow of separates is preferred. A controller seems just silly (a toy) when the venue has a DVS or USB stick setup already there. You do kinda feel like a rock star if you show up and the gear is already there (mostly) set up for you. it goes to your head a little so it is easy to look at yourself as a professional and look down upon controller-ists as amateurs or closet DJs.

    I recently moved from a major city to a smaller town, semi-rural market and there are no clubs. There are a few bars, but none of them have DJ setup. So if I want to play on turntables and a mixer, I need to bring them all myself from home. Maybe if I am playing all night, it might make sense to me. However, if I am only playing for an hour with other DJs or bands, the controller starts to look a lot more appealing. A controller weighs 1-4 Kg. decks and a mixer and road cases weigh easily 25 Kg+. If you show up to a festival in the forest or on a farm with 10 other DJs all on controllers and you are the only one bringing decks and mixer, you start to feel like grandpa. A dinosaur, a relic from the past.

    In reality, I have both kinds of setup now. In my current rural market, most of the time it is controller for me these days. Sometimes if I’m lucky enough to play with multiple DJs at a show where we all prefer separates, we will coordinate and bring the separates, potluck style. I’ll bring a mixer. Someone else will bring CDJs or turntables. There is a nice communal aspect of playing on separates where DJs can just jump on the decks for a couple songs – tag team or round robin or a quick guest spot. With controllers, it feels more territorial to play on a controller that is not “yours”.

    There is a lot of other concerns, I’m sure… but this is what really stands out to me after moving from the city to a small town hours away from the city.

    1. The portablist scene is already the equivalent of hipsters with polaroid cameras.

      “I can take this anywhere with me and use it without plugging it in and without looking at a LCD screen. It is 100% analog. Check out this limited edition 7-inch scratch record (or Incredible monochome instant film). Try some of this kombucha my girlfriend made.”

      I’m only half kidding and I say this with all the love in the world. My roommate, she makes Kombucha and her boyfriend is a portablist and one of my good friends. He doesn’t have a polaroid camera, but if you substitute it for a portable turntable, he is a closet hipster. If anyone called him a hipster he would be mad, but he completely is.

  8. I’m a modular guy for the simple reason I prefer a hardware mixer at the core of my system vs. a midi mixer. If there were more all-in-one options that included a full hardware mixer, I’d consider switching back.

    BUT… I strongly disagree with Dan’s statement that “ease of setting up, convenience isn’t a choice as more of a forced decision” because no, those are absolutely a choice. And to some people they are a very important choice. To devalue their choice because it doesn’t fit with his choices is insanely arrogant. Everyone has different priorities.

    And the whole ‘what if drivers change and you end up with a paperweight’ argument is irrelevant to the all-in-one v. modular debate, because that’s a debate about laptops in the DJ booth. I’m switching to the the SC5000s (apparently next week according to my Denon rep, yay!) to remove a laptop from the mix. If there was a reliable way to do that with an all-in-one I would seriously be looking at that too.

    1. My point is that convenience is often forced on people. For a time, we lived in a flat that didn’t have room for my full set up, so it went into storage and I used my Z1/X1 combo if I wanted to play some tunes. Choice would be that you have no restrictions forcing you to go all-in-one (budget/space/family), yet you do so because you want to. If you buy a controller because it’s more convenient, the decision is made for you, ergo, it’s no longer a choice.

      1. That’s *your* logic, because you would have rather been using something larger. There are people out there who would go to the Z1/X1 combo as their first choice because they LOVE the convenience. And sometimes it’s just because they like what they like. I have a friend who still uses his old Denon rackmount HC4500 for all his shows. No exceptions. They have a fancy Nexus setup? He pushes it aside and drops down his big old wooden flight case with his 4500 in it. It isn’t because he is forced to do that, it’s because that’s what he wants to use.

      2. Did you learn any new techniques while using this minimal set-up? I find myself messing a lot more with FX just because I like assigning one of the parameters to the touch strip.

  9. I agree with having a real mixer rather than a midi one thats why I own a Pioneer DJ-SX. It sort of splits this argument in two because it has a standalone mixer and the convenience of an all in one. I also agree that it’s great when you can rock up to a professional venue with a few USB sticks and your headphones and have monitors and gear already set up for you. Thats the best.

    1. The SZ has a hardware mixer, not the SX. The SX has hardware channels for external sources, but is a midi mixer for the Serato channels. I wish they had done the audio routing like the SZ – if they had I would have switched to one of these years ago. Nice size, nice layout, great all around unit… Ah well…

  10. I’ve only been digital DJing for around 4 years. Before that I always used CDJs and turntables. I hated incorporating the laptop, and honestly I still do. I like seeing waveforms and searching a digital library (who misses carrying around doubles of CDs and records???), but there’s something to be said about purpose-built gear that just turns on and works. I am really happy to see the stand-alone units coming out which I really believe is the true way to go about it. Pioneer and Denon are getting there, but instead of screens in the players, they need a mixer with a large screen so we can align waveforms and see a nice big library to send to decks on either side.

    And while a small controller is portable and convenient, I personally do prefer the ability to use different mixers or decks depending on the gig- I definitely miss that flexibility with my old analog setup.

  11. I prefer modular. This is the way I grew up and the reason is that I can customize my setup and carry what I want. If I only need the mixer I have to carry only the mixer with me. Mixer + 1210 or Mixer + CDJ or Mixer + loopstation, iPad, push, maschine, novation, … if you like to experiment you will probably go with modular, if you grew up with digital and mainly do one thing than controllers are ok. But I still would hate to have to carry a whole controller if I only needed a mixer.

  12. You’ve really made me think with this.

    I’ve always had separate units, (whether CD based or turntables) and have recently been considering moving from my turntables to a set of XDJs. I haven’t even considered a controller for a second- but I don’t have a specific reason why.
    I guess it just feels like the natural path to swap 2xTTs for 2xXDJs and…the only thing putting me off is price. Whereas I could pick up an SX2 for less than the price of a single XDJ over here- which would be even more of a saving as I could then technically sell off my Rane.

    I’m sure an SX2 would cover everything I do, yet I still have never even considered it.
    I don’t really buy into the ‘controllers are a toy’ stigma because when it comes to CDJ/XDJs…I see them as controllers anyway.

    The only reason I can really think of that would have me skipping over an All-in-One is because I do tend to mess with different gear layouts. I do regularly add/remove an old CDJ I have from my setup. I swap out mixers when the feeling takes me from the few I have around.
    I think the idea of the flexibility would always push me towards separate units, regardless of cost/benefit ratio.

  13. As a mobile DJ there are times and places for both types of systems. Key thing to keep in mind is redundancy! If your computer shits out do you have a backup? If you lose a speaker is there a spare?
    Many all in ones are also stand alone mixers ala SX2 or the new denon kit.
    For a middle priced wedding outside I can kill it on an all in one or all in one with a TT.
    I always have a backup iPad, mixer, controller, speaker, microphone AND backup laptop AND a duplicate SSD, in the car or under the booth for emergencies.
    Also I flip all my gear including computers every 2-3 years so I don’t have to worry about obsolescence, or extreme wear and tear.
    I find that by flipping my gear that often I also get most of my $$ back when selling…if I waited longer I would lose lots of $$.
    I wouldn’t hate on the all in one controller DJs, as I am one at times, but mixing on ANY kind of vinyl is better.
    I find it crazy that on the new Pioneer Festival rigs with the screens you can’t run standalone Rekordbox with TT’s(meaning no laptop but with DVS timecode).
    Mark my words the ‘controller’ that will kill all the rest will be a TT/controller hybrid with screens that uses vinyl and a needle and can play time code or reg vinyl, but can play without..as a motorized controller(are you hearing me Denton 3700’s)
    As a mobile guy I would love it to be 10″ with pads like the reloop 8000’s…maybe with dual layers to play multiple channels with one deck….
    Also how bout an industry standard link cord be established so that I don’t have to have USB-b, USB-c, midi, Ethernet, DMX, rca’s…ect.
    Other thing to consider is that mobile DJs play in all conditions so dust/waterproofness and setup/tear down time matter.
    Also having done events in tropical locations I can definitely tell you that TT’s and humidity suck!

  14. If I had to pick a side, I’m more inclined to agree with Dan.

    Personally I prefer a modular setup that I can mix, match and upgrade any way I see fit. That’s why all-in-one controllers have never appealed to me. I would agree with Mark, however, on the point that quite a few people do want convenience of the all-in-one controllers – especially those who are not so tech-savvy.

    My current setup (MacBook Pro, Allen & Heath Xone:92, MOTU UltraLite MK4, 2x Allen & Heath Xone:K2, 2x Technics SL-1200MK5) is already quite high-end, but if price wasn’t an option I would probably switch to a pair of Pioneer CDJ-2000NXS2 or Denon SC5000 Prime.

    My only real argument is reliability. Even though my setup is very stable, a part of my feels uncomfortable with using a relatively fragile and finicky laptop as the nerve center of my setup. All the driver and compatibility issues can also be a pain. I couldn’t care less about stigma or other people’s perception, I would just prefer having a dedicated device for each job.

    CDJs are so overpriced that buying your own pair makes financial sense for very few people. Could I buy them if I really wanted? Sure, probably. It’s not that my current setup is exactly cheap either. I just can’t justify spending few extras grands just to get marginally more piece of mind.

      1. It’s true. The NS7III is near perfect for my needs. A larger platter and full standalone operation would see one as my go to DJ gear. There’s no doubt that there’s heaps of awesome shiny out there, but my needs are more simple than most.

        1. For a DJ who likes large platters, the NS7III would be a logical choice. If my budget was unlimited, I would go with Rane MP2015 and 2x Denon SC5000 Prime.

          Having said that, I could do without the large jogwheels on the SC5000. I’ve used the Xone K2 for years, so I’m used to seeking, bending and pitching with rotary encoders. In fact, if I could design my perfect DJ media player, it would be the SC5000 Prime (or rather its feature set), but with a smaller form factor (like Xone 2D) due to the jogwheel and pitch fader being replaced by rotary encoders.

            1. I have seen them live, but I have not actually tried them. The concept and form factor is nice though, but I find the design and build quality a bit too “plasticky” if you know what I mean.

              The D2 is, however, still a controller that needs a computer. A stand-alone media player with similar form factor would be pretty cool.

              1. NI have improved their build quality.
                I have been using the D2’s since the day they were released (some 2 years ago) and had no single issue until now.
                I also had the K2 and found that they are comparable in terms of quality, while the D2 is miles ahead in functionality.

  15. I’m a controller DJ but I always enjoy playing with the club mixer. The reason why I (and perhaps many other controller DJs) never really hate the idea of playing with separate club equipment is, I believe, actually related to logistics, etc. The club mixer is always at the center of the booth and is virtually fixed by its weight, if not actually bolted down. By contrast, the all-in-one DJ must find a spot towards the sides of the booth where he/she can lay out the gear – sometimes on slippery surfaces or where you must constantly ask others not to put down their drinks. If by some method this reality of the DJ booths changed globally, I think a lot more “real” DJs would start contemplating the idea of going all-in-one.

    1. Hand on heart, we barely know what’s coming at this point from anyone. I’m not sure they do either. This post is exactly as described. If the industry gleans some useful insight (just as we are) then it’s all good.

      1. Damn…I thought that Pioneer single deck controller is just around the corner. Or a standalone Traktor with jog, screen and dvs capability.

                    1. I’m not saying Native Instruments won’t do that, but when they released the original Kontrol S4, critics really panned the jog wheels on the controller, and N.I.really took that criticism to heart. To be fair, no other controller (at the time) had anywhere near as nice of a jog wheel, and that was right at the point when controllers were starting to come into their own. When CD DJs ripped on N.I. for having “toy-like” jog wheels, they spent a lot of time figuring out their next steps. They didn’t just make a better jog wheel, they adopted the touch strip method made famous by the Novation Twitch.

                      So… Traktor is still very popular, and many companies make controllers with bigger jog wheels, but if you look at how Native Instruments works (as a system) you start to see why they wouldn’t want to invest a lot of money to make low margins fighting among a field of other competitors, instead, designing-in a way to quickly and easily incorporating other company’s equipment so they consolidate their own software and add-on hardware.

                      So… creating a new jogwheel only controller *could* happen, but it probably won’t… they have bigger fish to fry.

                      The one thing that still bugs me about N.I. is their lack of deep integration of Traktor with Maschine.

                    2. Your last sentence. I only have DJ gear because I bought Maschine and saw a few videos on youtube of maschine being used to control Traktor. I bought an Audio2 and quickly became frustrated with controlling the software with maschine mappings.

                      I want to create loops in maschine and have them immediately accessible for me scratch with my DVS at either the master, group, or sound level. Imagine creating your loop and immediately selecting any of your 16 sounds to scratch while the rest of the loop keeps playing.

                    3. Actually, there’s no big competition for this type of controller for Traktor. Except the high end Pioneer models, there’s none (well, the discontinued SC2000)

                      I’m pretty sure there’s a giant market gap for a well integrated modular jog wheel controller under $1,000 (like an SC5000 without the processor and standalone stuff).

                      Read every topic on the netz about this and people are screaming for this exact thing.
                      I wonder what takes NI so long to build one. It’s not rocket science, right?

            1. No, they realize that 1) Touch strips are superior for space/functionality and 2) if you’re absolutely dead-set on rotating something, you’re 99% going to want to use a record on a turntable.

                1. I’m not saying anyone *has* to use anything, but I did comment on why I think Native Instruments went with the touch strips. To your point of Jogwheels… I don’t know what else to recommend but there are 7″ turntables that are made for portable scratch DJs that are kinda’ like jogwheels… or CDJs you can plug in directly to the S8. My point is that Native Instruments really did think this mixer through, touch strips are built-in, and other forms of control are as easy as any other mixer to plug in. I’m not entirely sure if you can toggle back and forth between analog and HID/MIDI modes. I’ve used a couple record players just to test out the one-button option, and it was pretty fast and easy.

              1. I JUST WANT THE OPTIOn to lock the shift button so I can scratch with my X1 and my D2s. I need the hand that holds the shift button for the fader. I have talked to a survey dude at NI HQ in Hollywood, I have sent messages to people I think might have access to NI but no go. I guess I have to print some device to latch my shift button.

  16. One look at my setup will tell you what I prefer: modular. Ideally, I want one box for each purpose – one that does its thing, and does it well. A custom mix of those boxes will allow me to do what I want, how I want – and if they don’t, I’ll hack them into submission.

    That being said, I can’t always rock up to a gig with what is now 3 meters of gear weighing approx. 50kg altogether. That’s for big events, where you (ideally) get plenty of setup time, a proper sound check etc. – but let’s face it, none of us only ever play big events. Sometimes you just need something portable to comfortably fit into a small booth – so all-in-one controllers are definitely useful. And really, you can play a solid set on that – most of them allow you more creative flexibility than a CDJ + mixer combo anyway.

    I’d say it’s damn near impossible to answer this question. Both methods are legit and justifiable, depending on the use case.

    1. Right, even though my all-in-one does most of what I want for playing back tracks, I still like to use Maschine as well. That is my optimum layout, but I’m still very happy using (just) my S8 anywhere I go. I usually do not feel like I’m missing something other than some very soecific little tricks I like to use.

  17. Well I’ve got both, and they both have their plus and minus sides.

    For quite some time my main gigging setup was a coffin containing two Denon HS5500 media players and an A&H Xone:92 – but the problem is, the hard drives in the Denons are full, and it’s not possible to fit larger ones. Now even when using this standalone setup, I still found myself needing a laptop because it was just far easier to browse my library on a 15″ screen than the small screens on the Denons.

    So now I’ve gone with laptop plus either a DDJ-SX2 or a DDJ-RZ. Certainly smaller and lighter (even the RZ) than the coffin case.

    The urge is still there to replace the Denon 5500s with something though, but I keep telling myself I have the controllers and it’s not really necessary.

    Pioneer XDJs are one option but having been spoiled by the 5500s I’m put off by having to use USB sticks or external HHDs. I was patiently waiting to see what Denon were coming out with, but now the SC5000 has surfaced, the price is an issue (wouldn’t have been if they were priced at or below the XDJs). Again though, no internal HDD.

    As you can probably tell from the above, I really did love the HS5500s and IMO it’s a great shame that Denon never took that concept and ran with it.

    So as internal storage is a big plus for me, and the screen real estate of a laptop beats even the SC5000 screens, I think I’m sticking with the controllers.

    1. What’s the advantage of an internal hdd over external devices?
      You could easily hook up 3 external drives + an SD card to the SC5000.
      Now that should be enough storage?

  18. As the local American… what the fuck is a “separate”?

    Aaaaaaaanyway

    If space, money, and effort were of no object, I know I would not use CDJs and a Mixer. I wouldn’t use an all-in-one either. I would use a mixer, and then modular devices to impact how I interact with Traktor. That might be D2s, or Maschine, or a Push, or maybe a turntable, etc. But I have very little need for jog wheels due to my workflow. The mixer is the only piece I really care about.

    I do want to build my rig for my needs, though. All-in-ones are always limited for me, and I need to augment either the structure, or add stuff to it regardless.

    I have a multitude of set ups, and always step away from turntables and CDJs for X1s, or D2s along with some sort of mixer. But I’ve always loved modular devices, and I am far from the average DJ in needs and workflow.

    1. As the local American… what the fuck is a “separate”?

      We couldn’t think of a collective term for “turntables, media players, and mixers” so plumped for the generic HIFI term for individual units. “Not controllers” didn’t feel right.

          1. Does it? I don’t agree with that at all. Modular devices are, to me, individual pieces that do specific tasks. For example, technically, a turntable is a modular device, to me. Yes, the turntable can stand alone, but so can a CD deck, and a D2. But if they are part of a larger set up, they become an individual module, hence modular.

  19. As a 30 year hobbyist, my ideal setup is to honor both analog and digital setup. So I’m caught in between, separatist mentality for analog, and all-in-one for digital. My current setup reflects this. I can pluck the controller out if I’m going pure digital or put the 1200s if I want to play my 80s 12″ for a purist experience. The only beef I have with this setup is that I’m not convinced the analog preamps in this controllers are good enough to match the separates. So an outboard preamp might be the solution.

  20. My current setup – Denon mcx8000 and a pair of Tech 1200s honors my roots in analog and the ” now” which is digital. I have access to all- software, usb standalone, DVS, and pure analog. I can pluck out the controller if practicality is called upon or connect the tables when I want the purist experience playing my 80s 12″ collection. It’s more authentic that way. DVS is ok but of very little practical value for me and I wouldn’t base a decision to acquire turntables on that basis alone. But that’s just my opinion. In my mind, this setup tries to achieve the balance of analog and digital and managing the logistical demands of an all-out separates setup. The only downside- I’m not convinced the phono preamps in any controller will match those of the separates, so an outboard phono preamp might be a solution.

  21. https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/4741596f24e44d2e32730c8eebdb6113a410b7485a24e115f50a00ba36d1b9db.jpg My current setup. The S2 does everything I need it to do and is easy to transport. I genuinely enjoy performing with it as I really like Traktor’s workflow and I like how it responds to the software with whatever routine or techniques I have adapted. People complain about the use of four decks so I solved that problem by custom mapping an X1 Mk1 to my setup for full use of decks C & D including all effects, the EQ’s that are most important to my workflow, and transport controls. I also own CDJ-400’s with an Allen & Heath Xone 22 as an alternative and can throw on my Stanton ST-150 if I want to play vinyl or use DVS. I truly embrace both all in one and modular setups as they can really compliment each other in many different ways.

  22. I’m still waiting to hear from a controller owner who bought one because they genuinely wanted one and not as a compromise. They must be out there. I cannot bear the idea that despite their obvious brilliance, controllers are seen as compromise purchase.

    1. In the area i live in, everyone uses controllers. (except scratch DJs who use DVS). They may start off with an entry level controller as a (price) compromise when starting out as a closet DJ. However, when they start gigging and taking it serious, they will save up for months to get that shiny new high end controller they have been lusting after. We are a semi-rural area of small towns – there are no “clubs”, only bars and none of them have a house DJ system. Everything is BYO – all you get is RCA or XLR inputs and a sound system. I moved here from the city and I was shocked to find out before my first festival gig I had to bring all my own mixing equipment. I showed up and everyone else was looking at me funny setting up a mixer and turntables since everyone was using controllers. I felt so old – like i was still using a blackberry with everyone else on iPhone 7. I’ve seen amazing performances by some of these guys that use all of the features offered on controllers and they work really hard and play really hard to put on a good show. I think this is the way things are going to go eventually – kids these days are really looking for a show.

      I do wonder if something is lost by having a set that is so tightly programmed and choreographed that it doesn’t leave space for for going off into unplanned directions depending on the crowd mood, reaction, etc. Some of my best sets are the ones where how I was interacting with a particular crowd completely changed where I thought I had wanted to go originally. I also miss the open communal feeling of having one mixer and set of decks that everyone is playing together on. it opens up possibility for impromptu guest spots, tag team sets, etc. With controllers, it feels more territorial because this is “my” controller and that is “your” controller.

      For the under 25 crowd and in small town or rural markets like mine, there is no stigma with controllers. People don’t even consider buying separates. Maybe if they go to the city and play at a club with an actual DJ rig, then they will have an interest in learning or practicing. But even then if they did pick up a rig of separates, the separates is the backup rig or the “toy” for using at home in your bedroom for shits and giggles. the controller is primary, first and only thing that comes out to a gig.

      Based on my experiences seeing this other side of things…. I wonder if in 15 years, separates DJs will be like hipsters with medium format film cameras or polaroid cameras. Maybe there will still be a good number of people using separates, but it will be seen as a luxury while the controller is the bread and butter. We’re already seeing the beginning of this. What was the last DJ mixer for under $1500 USD that came out that had the whole industry on its head and every DJ drooling with lust over? I don’t even recall. People lust after a Rane MP2015 or Pioneer NXS2 or S9. That is a luxury item at a luxury price. Just like the technics SL-1200GR and the CDJ-2000NXS2.

      1. The portablist scene is already the equivalent of hipsters with polaroid cameras.

        “I can take this anywhere with me and use it without plugging it in and without looking at a LCD screen. It is 100% analog. Check out this
        limited edition 7-inch scratch record (or Incredible monochome instant film). Try some of this kombucha my girlfriend made.”

        I’m only half kidding and I say this with all the love in the world. My roommate, she makes kombucha and her boyfriend is a portablist and one of my good friends. He doesn’t have a polaroid camera, but if you substitute it for a portable turntable, he is a closet hipster. If anyone called him a
        hipster he would be mad, but he completely is.

        1. Yes, but I’m waiting for Traktor to unlock the STEMS deck tracks onto individual audio outputs. Pushing individual tracks out gives me way more control over the effects than the stereo mix-down that the STEMS decks currently utilize.

          The Xone (if I remember correctly) has that 4th EQ knob, but with shift mode on, I could push 6 levels of EQ, and that can be useful for the dynamics of the lows that usually get summed into everything below whatever the mids lower range is (because there’s a lot of energy down there). I’ve recently started bringing my own subwoofer to my shows and tuning it for “hi-lows” which really seems to liven up drums, low brass, and bass guitar.

          Currently, I’m not using much more than 16 trigger pads in a matrix. It’s not that I don’t think I can, but my style of play doesn’t even really need 16 pads.

          While the X1s are great controllers, for my style of play, I really do need the pads I get with the S8. Also, I’m pretty happy with the controller screens. I’d like to see them remain active when I toggle to using Maschine, and hopefully, Native Instruments will work on that… so we can use the laptop screen for Maschine, and the S8 screens for Traktor.

    2. Go back far enough in time and I did buy a controller for that reason. However it wasn’t a “controller” as we know them now – just small jogs, buttons and a mono display. The Numark DMC1 was a rackmount controller for PCDJ software, run from a serial port (remember those?).

      After meeting Jorgen Hedberg at PLASA where he was demonstrating DJing from a PC (poss 1998?) it was an immediate purchase. I think it was the same show where Phil (a.k.a Pee Cee) was exhibiting his infamous yellow furry DJ computer. Prior to that I’d been playing CDs from a Denon DN2500F.

      My next controller was a Denon HC4500. Again, no mixer but it did have onboard USB audio. Controllers with big jogs and mixers didn’t exist back then.

    3. I bought a VCI-100 as my first all-in-one controller (excluding an audio interface), and that wasn’t a compromise. That was a bad ass device I used for a LONG time. I used it more than my turntables/mixer setup because it did so much more.

    4. I’ve gone through lots of controllers over the years, & yes, nearly all have been compromises.
      The only one that didn’t feel like a compromise (at the time) was the old Vestax VC1 300. It was pretty much just a pair of decks & a 2 channel mixer, & it was fairly close to playing on regular decks (i’m not a turntablist, so can’t comment on it’s scratch performance).
      I’m currently modular (sort of). With an Kontrol Z2 & either a pair of X1 Mk2s or a pair of the old Denon DNSC2000’s. ….& i’m fairly happy with this.
      I do have a Denon MC6000 though, for simple “plug & play” gigs, where you need to get in & out with the minimum of fuss. But i much prefer playing on the Z2.

  23. I’ve done both. There’s a lot to be said for being able to pack your whole setup in a single backback or flightcase and going to play a show. I used a Denon MC6-000 for years doing house parties, and yes, having just a single unit to plug in and out of is fantastically convenient. Even now for smaller gigs, I use my crews XDJ RX, and you can’t get much more all in one than that. However, I appreciate the modularity and expandability of the full Nexus range; being able to swap out a CDJ for a controller, or add two extra decks, is a welcome flexibility, and we’re hard pressed for controllers with true four-deck playback controls, outside of custom mappings. Not having to switch between layers is a huge convenience.

    At the end of the day, my preferred setup is my Push mapped to 4 decks in Traktor, with my 2000nxs mixer as the interface. I can add in extra audio sources if need be, but I still have my fully customized playback setup to really flex what I’m doing. Best of both worlds.

  24. I’m not going to argue, I’m just going to state my opinion. My choice to buy a Kontrol S8 was purely about options and control. I hate jog wheels (concersely, I live touch strips), and I love using Traktor (for a myriad of reasons. I like that I *can* use my controller with turntables (should I choose to), but I don’t. I use Maschine with Traktor, and I’m pushing some boundaries with stems (to be conservative about it). Arguably, there is no better interface for stems than the Kontrol S8, but that’s how I choose to play. I could have bought a modular system for $2000 more, but it still would not do at least 30% of what I do with my Kontrol S8.

    I looked at all the options, and this is what I chose after many months of research. To call my kit “a toy” means you really do not understand what I am doing. Discrete instrument tracks is really something A-to-B DJs usually do not fathom… but so what? I’m not here to change minds, or put anyone else down. I’m simply stating why I love my (almost) all-in-one (if it really handled Maschine natively, then it’d be all-in-one to me… which doesn’t mean I love my gear any less).

    1. I feel the same for Traktor (and Maschine).
      But (if money wasn’t an issue) you could easily swap the S8 for a NXS2 or an MP2105 and 2 D2’s and have a way more capable setup.
      Nothing missing, only cool stuff added.

      1. I learned how to customize Traktor with my Novation Twitch… arguably, the Kontrol S8 and S5 are more robust versions of the Twitch. I’m looking forward to more features and flexibility of Traktor 3, but right now, I *could* use my S8 with Maschine (if I had to), since the pads are the same.

        I’ve tried a lot of software, and I’m perfectly happy with Maschine and Tracktor together, but since I got the S8, everything got way more complex (due to a project I bought the S8 for).

        If money was no issue, I’d love to have a deep-dish conversation with the project managers of both projects and really push for a more integrated approach. Heck, if I could just work with them, I’d bring my project to the table and ask them how they could help implement how to fully integrate said project, because it’s getting rather complicated really fast.

      1. Jog Wheels don’t feel like vinyl, they don’t have needle search, they take up too much space on a controller, they tend to bend in a carry bag, and then have a wonky spin that can sometimes rub against the surface causing unwanted behavior.

        I first noticed how weird they were when I went from Vinyl to CDs, and they just didn’t feel right to me, even when they were weighted and had added resistance. The “fishing reel” effect of of cranking and cranking and cranking (and sometimes slipping off the jogs) just to get to the spot in the song I wanted, left a lot to be desired (especially when I accidentally hit a button on the deck). I guess that got resolved with cue points, but with the skip forward and backward buttons, I just felt better using my “vinyl feel” interaction with touch strips.

        Okay, so maybe I don’t *hate* them, I just really don’t like using them. Is that better?

        1. If Jog wheeled controllers were really that delicate nobody would use them yet alone spend upwards of $2k on them. Sounds like you are a little rough with your equipment. And it also sounds like you don’t do any type of scratching or any other type of turntable tricks (which is fine). What do you mean that Jog-Wheels don’t have a needle search? Some units have a touch-strip for needle searches and all of them allow for you to use the Jog-wheels to do searches. Granted that isn’t the best method, but I’m never going to give up being able to to turntable-tricks, which touch strip controllers are incapable of doing effectively.

  25. My ideal setup for home would be a DDJ-RZ with Serato and my 1210s occupying 2 of the channels.. then i kind of have the best of both worlds.. at the moment I’ve got an SX2 with one of the decks plugged in (due to space). but the SX2 is never actually wired up because i take it to gigs with me.

    I just don’t see the reason to Justify spending loads of money on Pioneer CDJs and a mixer these days, for a start it takes more time just getting music onto some form of media to use them, my downloaded tracks are ready in Serato in seconds.

    So yes i bought a controller because i really wanted one, it has all the features, nicer jog wheels than any CDJ I’ve played on (why they don’t have Aluminium Jog wheels on CDJs ill never know) and the filters sound really nice because of Serato’s software. My only upgrade will be one day to buy the RZ for the home setup as its an awesome piece of kit.

    1. Personally, I prefer the CDJ mechanical jogs over the alu touch jogs.
      I own both CDJ2000 and DDJ-SX, and play regularly on the DDJ-SZ.
      To me the mechanical jogs are more precise and responsive. Each to his own…

  26. That pic with the captions.. has anyone ever actually been stupid enough to buy those Pioneer Tour decks?? i just think you would have to be registered insane to even think about it.

      1. Yeah I’m thinking those people who just have to get the most expensive version of anything will have them gathering dust in their ‘DJ Room’

        I always laugh at the irony of creating a product that basically tells you the 2 grand version isn’t very sturdy, i still can’t work out why my 800 quid controller has lovely aluminium platters yet they still stick those horrible feeling plastic things on the 2000s

  27. i’m certain of a few things.
    i buy lots of devices. i then remove the useless functions/hardware; buttons, faders, etc., that i have no plan to use.
    THEN, i move the useful hardware to where it works best, i.e. “allowing for multiple simultaneous use (turn on low kill line one, turn off low kill line two)”
    both, for mixing, and performance, progress lies in “facilitating new physical actions”; an example of this is how i have the pitch fader of the 5500 in a better position to move it “between/along with” moving the deck, while scratching.
    the issue isn’t “all in one” vs. “modular.” the issue is 1-how, and 2-to what extent are WE(cause let’s be honest, aren’t you all tired of excluding me and costing us both $) going to design a way to allow for customization, in either/or/both all-in-ones and modular.

    That deck-in-a box approach is closer.(provide the parts and let the user arrange them) they’d be better served by adding some play/pause/stutter button options and strong pitch-fader.

    I keep giving this sermon, yet i feel like i’m talking to a wall. you can’t have “new” if you won’t let go of old. i’m guessing that we haven’t even discovered the new functions/buttons that are going to revive interest/sales.

  28. It’s interesting to see that not many have focused on answering just the question itself, and instead have gone for a much broader answer – not that there’s anything wrong with such. Then again, it is a rather difficult question to answer, even though it’s technically a basic question. It’s just that it’s such a heavily loaded question that makes it so hard to answer, so odds are I’ll wind up answering in a similar manner to others out there.

    When I made the switch to hardware back in 2007 (before that I did everything with, believe it or not… WinAMP 2 – no mixing, none of the software dual instances of WinAMP 2 or 3 tricks, just countless hours spent memorizing my music and then being what I felt was very well practiced in changing the track and getting it to where I wanted the next one in short order), I honestly couldn’t decide whether I wanted an expensive separates setup, or risk going with one of the newer setups such as the Xone:3D which were relatively new at the time. Oh wait, I had all of $600 CAD to buy my first setup, so it quickly came down to whether I wanted to go with one of the Numark BattlePak’s or Vestax’s VCI-100. Wound up going with the BattlePak at the time because the VCI-100 was getting mixed reviews, but I also wasn’t certain if the BattlePak would serve my needs. Heck, the salesguy I was talking with kept telling me to be patient and save up for another month or two and just get a pair of TT200’s and a DM1050 because it was a significantly better mixer (and he was right, but that’s a different story). A few years later I upgraded to my current setup.

    Am I happy with the setup I have now? Yup. I still love my pair of STR8-150’s and Native Instruments’ Z2, and eventually I’ll add on a pair of D2’s. Looking at the cost of the D2’s does make me contemplate whether to get those or the S8, since the S8 is technically only $240 CAD more if I go with my usual store (only $166.14 if I go with their competitor’s pricing on Amazon) and it would still play well with my current gear.

    ….But what if I were to start out new again? There are a great deal more options on the market for either option, and arguably it’s a lot harder to decide between the two. Ever since Numark announced the NS7-II a few months after I picked up my current setup, I’ve been seriously tempted by the offerings that the all in ones bring to the proverbial table, so I’ll just say this – if I were to start over or didn’t have any gear I probably wouldn’t even have to think twice about going for an all in one controller… It would be more of a case of which one to get – NS7 III or Native Instruments’ S8. Sure, there’s an appeal with separate as you’re able to upgrade a single item whenever you wish, but it’s also a lot easier for GAS (Gear Acquisition Syndrome) to kick in because of such. With an all-in-one, provided it will meet what you want to do (and does it well) in combination with how most gear nowadays is incremental updates/upgrades when the new shiny comes out it’s a lot easier to simply focus on the most important part – enjoying your gear and djing.

      1. Glad to hear you like it! Only problem for me is money for djing competes for money with the other hobbies I’m into, so we’ll see if a pair of them ever happens. Almost snagged a pair last time NI put them on sale…. They should do that again, it would be a lot more tempting to pick them up if they were under $1k CAD with GST for a pair!

  29. If weight and transport aren’t an issue, I’ll take modular everyday. Nothing gives sound colour like discrete analog circuitry, an A10 or any other audio interface will sound beefier after it runs through and picks up the personality of a decent mixer.

    1. The vast majority of analog DJ mixers are not built around discrete circuitry (i.e. individual transistors used instead of op-amps.) I actually don’t know of any that are, though I suspect that at least one of the boutique rotary mixers out there could be.

      1. Most digital mixers have signal paths before it hits a DSP, generally even a DAC will be at the start of this chain gaining colour and warmth from the circuitry. There are only a few that I know of that use the audio interface as an end point like the Z2, I’ve had one and it sounded as transparent as a studio interface or an all-in-one controller output.

        1. With all due respect, I think you’re making some conceptual mistakes. Single transistors (or tubes) have a roughly square-law dependence on the input; the output current sunk/sourced from the load scales by approximately the square of the input voltage. When the input voltage changes more than a very small amount, the non-linearity of this input-output relationship necessarily means that the output is distorted slightly. Specifically, second-order harmonics are emphasized, which leads to the archetypal “warm, fat, thick, lush, *insert adjective here* analog” sound.

          ICs (such as op-amps) are designed to have a fairly wide linear output range, so they don’t cause the same output distortion. Almost all modern DJ gear uses op-amps in the signal path, so pleasing (and archetypally “analog”) coloration of the sound is not present.

          In a nutshell, the analog portions of the signal path in DJ gear don’t add much, if any, coloration to the sound (they are designed this way on purpose.)

          1. My personal experience is that a DJM and a high end Xone are toned differently to give a different feel to the sound, just as every DAC. Even my ZED series lends different tonal values. All I’m saying is that a modular setup allows you to build a kit that caters to your practical needs as well as your personal sound requirements. I personally haven’t heard an all-in -one sound as “beefy” as a modular set up using a mixer.

            1. I’d bet that the reason you haven’t heard an all-in-one sound as “beefy” as a modular setup is that modular setups are designed to run on mains power, and controllers are generally designed to run on USB power, perhaps with an added external supply. This means that there isn’t as much power available to drive the outputs, making them quieter.

              I’ve also heard plenty of people claim that one mixer has a “different tone” than another, but I’m fairly certain that this is nothing more than the placebo effect at work. Someone spends a lot on a nice mixer, so they want to believe it sounds “better” than the competing product (because otherwise they made a poor choice with their money), so they perceive “better” sound. It’s very telling that nobody has attempted to use a function generator and an oscilloscope to conclusively show these alleged tonal differences. My hunch is that such an empirical experiment would show that there is little to no difference between mixers (ignoring EQ and effects, which are supposed to color the sound.)

              Incidentally, I use (and prefer) separate pieces of gear, because I like to change things when the whim suits me. I performed my last couple of gigs with an iPad running DJ Player and a dual-output sound card connected to the house mixer. I use the same iPad and sound card at home to play beat loops while I scratch.

              1. It looks like we should lower the conclusive broad remarks. Your point dj_penguin “that nobody has attempted to use a function generator and an oscilloscope to conclusively show these alleged tonal
                differences.” might be true if applied only to DJ equipment instead of mixers and audio gear.

                I’d guess that not many here would know that a single magazine Stereophile has been doing precisely that that you negate, for decades. One example (go to fig 6 and its comments)
                https://www.stereophile.com/content/nad-c-372-integrated-amplifier-measurements
                Review after review audiences and technicians have reached to conclusions and generalizations about different components and circuits. Basic assumptions that then are used (together with discerning ears) to make gear choices.

                That said, I’d love to have the above depth of analysis available for DJ equipment and not just make educated guesses sound wise, as we do know… which is a very valid point for using separates (upgreadable) instead of a fixed all-in-one controllers.

                1. I read a few of them. Personally, I feel that every person has a different preference of sound and that people should build what sounds good to them.

              2. My old S4 had a PSU and my Z2 was powered, but as I said, my experience with a device that had the DAC at the end point was that they sounded a bit too transparent for my personal taste. It’s the same reason that I use a portable amp on my DAP for leisure listening, but remove it if I am using the DAP for analytics.

          2. The musicality of distortion is a whole level more complex than your summary here dj_penguin.
            In basic musical terms third order harmonics have a tuneful quality instead of the even order ones, no arguing about this.
            However the varied opinions reflect the variation that the particular design of the circuits and its components implementation define what kind of harmonics those equipments add. Have a look at a Gearslutz’s thread: https://www.gearslutz.com/board/so-much-gear-so-little-time/473714-tube-harmonics-2nd-3rd-order.html
            “even order harmonic distortion from triodes (one kind of tubes) and a far greater quantity of odd order harmonic distortion from pentodes (other kind)…”.
            Thus tubes need a large portion of 3rd harmonics to sound warm, nevertheless I’d dare to say thay tubes are more appreciated because its dynamics more than else.
            Another poster focuses on the freq spectrum of the distortion, which might explain the paradox: “tubes ENHANCE even order harmonics, while transistors ENHANCE odd order harmonics. Both platforms produce even and odd order harmonics. Even order tends to sound warmer and fatter, with an emphasis on the low mids. Odd order sounds harsher and emphasizes the high mids and top end.”

            ///Fortunately, the above points are a rather XX century (and 00s) debate, because nowadays every audio component is migrating to some kind of digital format/device, striving for ACCURACY instead of COLORATION. This way you (we) might strive to get the music correct – as we desire it – at the source, and thus do not let it depend on the particular reproduction system it plays on.
            Of course this does not preclude nostalgia niches to be kept alive, the same radio waves stations still hold on, while internet thrives everywhere.
            Better understanding supports coexistence

  30. I own both, I have a rane 62 and cdj 850s at home. I just bought a denon mc4000 last week because it’s small and portable for quick gigs. For me…no controller replicates the joy of using a standard cdj mixer/turntable which ever you prefer. I even had the original SZ and the platter is just not the same, (responsive) and I have no idea why pioneer can’t just put the same platter on a controller. Until that happens I will always keep a normal setup for comfortability. My 62 has been around for years no issues since it came out, I have more faith in the older setups…i’ve had a few controllers kick the bucket in less than a year. Like you mentioned it’s not the money, DJs will always find a way. But ideally you need both, cheap controller for a quick gig, normal setup for a big performance. Because i really hated unplugging my setup at home, put them in a bag transport, then reassemble when you get back home. That’s just me.

      1. Size wise yes, but it was no cdj platter. I had the first set of DDJ-SZ’s traded it in a couple weeks in. I hear the latency on the new version is better which was the issue. The platter wasn’t responsive as a normal cdj.

        1. I think I read that the RZX is the only Pioneer controller to feature the platters from the CDJ line (pressure sensitive surface instead of capacitive jog wheels). The SZ definitely has capacitive jog wheels, though.

          Edit:
          Official comment from Pioneer DJ (found on their forums)

          The DDJ-RZX was developed based on the CDJ-2000NXS2, so we have used the same industry leading CDJ-2000NXS2 jog wheels in the DDJ-RZX.

          1. Yet the ones on the CDJ2000s are still made of cheap feeling plastic.. I don’t scratch so not sure the latency is a massive issue for me but the feel and quality of the platters is far better on my SX2 than a CDJ, but thats my opinion, i use them for cueing a lot.

  31. – why title the article “let’s argue”?
    – I agree with someone else, “separates” is a strange word. “let’s argue” about “separates.” If I plug a guitar into my controller or mixer I mean that’s not a “separate”. Vinyl has soul. Drum machines have soul. Music has soul, so let’s not use such arbitrary technological terms. Traktor in sync mode through a 6 year old controller playing a very synthetic form of electronic perhaps has less soul but that’s the exception that proves the rule that DJing music has soul and is an emotional pursuit that inspires a lot of passion in people,
    “DJs would prefer.” Well you could just do a poll we don’t need to “argue.”
    – The Roland 808 hasn’t done very well but it’s very easy to argue that it’s awesome just with the evidence of the amazing sets people have done with it. It can be expanded, it has sync and inputs and an analog signal path and this is all nice. I would prefer an 808 over a CDJ 800 a Gemini PT2400 and a technics mixer!
    – Yeah obviously DJs prefer a modular set-up but I wouldn’t be disappointed if someone let me have a go on an RX!
    – Budget controllers can be put into external mode and then you can mix them with an analog mixer and expand, plug in Drum machines or use Ableton. So there are no limits to thiseven those who own a budget controller (say DDJ-RB, such as myself) have further possibilities to build a wider, sexier, preferable set-up. That’s nice.
    – Mixers have soul. Analog signal path has soul. Music sounds better when it’s run through more cables and analog circuitry. Small controllers are small and sometimes that has less soul. But what if it’s Kaytranada playing all his groovy boot-legs in some nice Montreal nightclub. You aren’t complaining if you get to play a set after him on his S2? Well maybe you are I dunno.

    What do people think of my points?

    1. I think one thing in “all-in-one” “controllers” in favour of CDJs is that CDJs are a weird concept. They aren’t used to play CDs. They don’t work as well at a lot of stuff. They are expensive. But I might be wrong I mean they are in every club. I don’t prefer CDJs to anything, except maybe this article

  32. I’m sorry, but what is different about the sound card in a standalone mixer from the 24bit one in my MCX8000? What mystique is there in having more cables? Because Paris Hilton owns one its a terrible thing? Elijah Woods plays on turntables, so do we hate those? Your modular setup doesn’t have replaceable parts. My controller burns out, 1400 bucks. One of your cdj pieces go down, its what 1500 bucks for the one cdj? I don’t feel like your side (Dan) of this discussion is based on anything but your own bias. There is little to no substance in any of these points. As someone who is associated with a DJ blog I feel you should have stronger points. As it is, its all personal opinion glaring in the face of reality and actual information to the contrary of your thoughts. You do know that CDJ’s have the same circuit boards and resistors a controller has? A sound card is the same in an usb interface to a cdj to a controller. Granted some are nicer than others but why would one be more prone to failure than any other?

    Lets stop with this silly debates on cdj/vinyl/controller. Its not about the gear and all these articles seek to do is divide a community that should be driven by the love of music and desire to share it with others.

    1. You say that, but sentiment here agrees with my argument (generally). Like I said in my bit, I’m not saying that’s my personal view, just how I think the situation is with the community. The whole discussion is around what people would prefer. Empirical evidence of one or other being superior is irrelevant.

      Also, you can’t compare fricken Frodo to Paris Hilton.

  33. As some have said before me, it’s not really an argument, it’s about choice, it’s about preference. It’s really about how you play and what the audience expects:

    Sound Quality. There is a strong argument for the quality of sound for analog vs controllers and dependent upon the controller, sound quality may be compromised. The real question is how much? Is it material enough for the particular audience?

    Performance. I’ve seen DJ’s rock sets with both types (modular or separates vs all-in-controllers), so its about the individual.

    Audience needs. Some audiences expect a glitz show, some expect scratch mastery, some smooth blends, sometimes it changes throughout the night or by genre. The DJ’s job: Rock the party. Satisfy your audience.

    I bought my current controller (a Vestax VCI-400) because I wanted the flexibility (pads, 4 channel, standalone mixer) and portability (size). The danger is if something goes wrong with part of it, recovery versus a modular setup may be challenging (I have used instant doubles in Serato to recover when one of the jogs went through a acting up phase). I still love it, still use it, thinking about upgrading to a Denon MC-8000 or 7000, but seeing to many issues with those on the Serato forums.

    I would love to add “Modules” though the standalone mixer part of the VCI-400. For example, D2’s for Traktor or a TT for scratch performance, if Serato would help the now orphaned Vestax VCI -400 owners with the Vinyl driver upgrade, (TT’s attached to the VCI-400 work in Traktor but not Serato).

    If you can’t rock the crowd with your equipment then it does not matter what you choose. You must know how to use it effectively. If money is no object, I would argue that a high end al-in-one controller can give you the same flexibility and options as a modular setup. It’s all about what you prefer, how you use it and was the audience entertained.

    RD

  34. I own both cdj/mixer and a controller.
    They both do the same things according to my dj workflow.
    Where they differ is when I use them.
    Vestax VCI380- shorts and a t-shirt at my house chilling/quick impromptu small get togethers
    CDJ’S/Mixer- professional dress, Large parties/Corporate events, and sometimes at home.

  35. I prefer modular. But for a very nuanced reason: there’s no all-in-one that is exactly what I want, which is 3-4 CDJ-esque players glued together with a mixer in between and screens on each player (and no mirrored layout!). If that existed all glued together, I’d buy the all-in-one, even if it was just two media players and screens (like a Pioneer version of the mcx-8000).

    So despite owning an all-in-one for budget reasons, my ultimate desire is a modular setup (at the moment it’s 3 D2’s with a xone mixer) but only because no all-in-one currently exists that looks like my preferred setup.

      1. Shows how much I know about the Traktor world lol

        I’m still hoping someone releases something like the D2 for serato (and supports more than 2!)

        1. While not officially supported, this combination works, indeed.
          But from what I heard it’s a different story with more than 2 D2’s.

        2. That’s….. That’s downright gorgeous. And even better, the lack of symmetry/mirror imaging is barely even noticeable with such.

          EDIT: Looks like it might be a tad “fun” to manage all those cables though.

  36. As someone who has started taking out my Dvs setup to most gigs that require me to bring equipment instead of my Numark ns6 I obviously find the effort of transporting of a Dvs system worth it.
    Although I think some of the reason is that I really enjoy the DJM 900nxs2 and scored some cdj 800’s for cheap so much lighter than 1200’s.
    To each their own. If the ns7 wasn’t mirrored maybe that’d work well for me.

  37. I’m just going to state this one more just so we’re quite clear — our discussion was based on Dan feeling that most people that buy controllers really wish they could buy separates, and my feeling that people who buy controllers do it as a first choice. This is not a post about which is better, because that’s an entirely different discussion.

  38. I’m from the analog world (DJing since the mid 90s), but lately I sold EVERYTHING and part of the money went into an NS7 II plus a 17.3″ monster laptop DIY-ed into a tablet.
    I use to play 80-90-100 songs per hour, and believe me… carry 2-3-4 hundred records for a 3 hour set is not what one wants to do more than twice a year (not to mention the gear itself)

    This unit makes everything I ever wanted and even much more that was not possible with records (bleep, PnT, cue-points, slicer sampler etc.)

    I would like to have a CABLE free, modular SERIOUS, moving platter setup with 3 screens (11-13″ size, FHD) but as long as the big companies build sh** for those wannabe persons and for the “industry” leaders…. I will keep what I have and not wasting time looking for another gear that delivers 2-5% more for some serious money:

  39. I went from VDJ with a mouse via a cheap mixer TT’s and timecode to CDJ’s and DJM… had various types (CDJ800, CDJ850, CDJ400, CDJ2000) but now with a kid and a job and less and less time to freak I sold it all and went for a DDJ-RB…. I can do the same (maybe more) with a smaller footprint and defiantly smaller price tag.

    But If that truck with cash came in my street, I sure as hell buy myself two cd players and a mixer…. but I think multiple sets. My dream is to become the local dealer of dj stuff, a cafe with a recordshop in it, a meeting point for DJ’s where they can try all kinds of equipment. Like my little studio was for all my hometown DJ’s since I had Traktor, VDJ, Vinyl, CDJ’s, Turntables and a controller. Everybody could spin at my small room, everybody could just bring their own stuff and freak all night long…

    so yeah. Separates all the way. Modular is my thing!

  40. I only ever had 1210s and mixers, no DVS, until 6 months ago when I got an XDJ-RX.
    I just sold it and have bought a DVS set up. I just didn’t enjoy the XDJ – it virtually mixes for you – where’s the fun?
    Of course it has a ton of effects and other stiff but my DVS can do all that too.
    Controllers never again.

  41. I actually think you are partly wrong about this one Mark.
    Most people (dj’s) aspire to the highend separate modular “industry standard” units, just like people (car enthusiasts) aspire to highend super cars.
    Granted highend DJ equipment is less costly than most highend cars, but still; cost is a very important factor. Most DJ’s I know. have a very hard time justifying the cost of highend CDJ’s/mixers, so they end up with a controller at home. The size and capability of the controller is a great bonus for many, but cost is still the main factor IMO. Personally I do own 3 mixers and 4 cdjs (and a few controllers), but Im the odd exception among my peers.

  42. To simplify my opinion on this:

    Controllers for their ease of use and their extremely high cost-to-performance ratio. Even though this diminishes greatly when you enter in the realm of the MCX8000 and the likes, it still provides a better cost-to-performance ratio than a modular set-up like CDJs and turntables. If I wanted anything close to my MCX8000, I’m looking at a bare minimum of around $3,000 for a mixer and two turntables. And that still only gives me two out of the possible four Serato decks. Also, my MCX8000 is 40 pounds with its hard case. Find me a modular setup that weighs no more than 40 pounds altogether with hard cases. Don’t worry, I’ll wait.

    Modular setup for the professionalism feel and quality of the equipment. The only piece of professional gear I think lacks some quality control is the DJM-S9 since a buddy of mine broke his crossfader stem twice already. But there’s no denying that a mixer and two turntables looks more badass than a controller ever will. Even though CDJ setups look like giant controllers to me (especially the new Denon Prime lineup), they still look and feel more professional (most of the time) than a controller setup. Also, if something breaks, it’s easier to troubleshoot/fix the issue on a modular setup than it is with a controller.

    ………I didn’t simplify that at all…..well shit lol

  43. I’ve gone both ways over the last 6 years. I currently own and love the Denon MC4000 controller and a Xone 23:C mixer. I’ve had many other controllers and quite a few other mixers over the last few years. I actually went back to the Xone because of one very specific need that, basically, keeps me running back to a modular setup: FX send/return that’s assignable to one channel at a time. I use a Korg Kp3+ as my effects box and can’t make anything sound as good in software for use with a controller. It’s funny because I also feel peer pressured to leave the controller at home but all I do is drop mix and would mix that way on any type of gear. Heck, most DJs drop mix so it doesn’t matter. If money was no option, I’d buy some nice media players but the problem is that the ones I want don’t really exist at the moment. I can’t stand laggy timecode on CDJs so I make do with laptop keyboard mapping when using my Xone 23:C. I really wish Pioneer made a high-quality midi single-deck controller, without any screens. Just a simple well-build midi single-deck controller that I can buy 2 of and use in my modular setup would be nice. I know that Denon and Numark made them in the past, but they’re old and expensive now, or they have those faux record jog wheels that seem odd to me. I make due with Behringer CMD single-deck controllers combined with my Xone 23:C, but could afford to spend more for better build quality and feel.