DJ Expo 2015 starts today in Atlantic City, and after making a bigger blip on the show radar over the last couple of years, the amount of new releases and announcements at the show is notably bigger. And one of the biggest things not really announced but definitely teased and speculated about has been Pioneer DJ’s rekordbox software evolution. Well it seems like our buddy Damien Sirkis from Rekord Buddy fame may have just provided us with a first glimpse that lets us fill the dots.
The show has only just got under way, so we have nothing more than this picture to tear apart. I’ve asked Damien for as much as he can give us in the short term. But it does very much look like people’s suspicions were founded — it’s full DJ software very much in the vein of Serato DJ.
I’m just going to leave this here right now, and let you pour over the image and drop your feelings in the comments. But if it’s on show at DJ Expo, full details must be imminent.
So… say what you see. Off you go.
Mixvibes Cross 4!
Mixvibes has been out of the picture for a while, 3.0 was the end of them, All in house now
3 was the end for them?
I think he meant Rekordbox 3.0 was the end of the Mixvibes partnership.
exactly, 1 and 2 are Mixvibes and 3 and 4 are strictly Pioneer
2._ was the end of the Mixvibes partnership when it comes to Rekordbox. 3.0 was a new build from the ground up.
Rekordbox and Serato worked together and made a software collaboration
No.
It’s so similar to Serato I wonder if the two companies cut a deal to re-badge it for Pioneer…
You’re welcome :)
Tyvm, for the pics and vid… and rekord buddy.
Looks very Serato’ey! A re-skinned version with some tweaks maybe??
Perfect time for my Serato to have deleted half my library… hope it launches with the s9
It Won’t. The S9 is a Serato DJ mixer.
That doesn’t mean it won’t work with the S9. The 900SRT works with Rekordbox and that’s a Serato mixer. I could see Pioneer providing Rekordbox DJ along with the mixer and also advertising to Serato users, much in the way that the SZ is advertised for Serato but also is fully functional with Virtual DJ 8.
Think about this logically — why would Serato have anything to do with this? Why would they actively help their biggest partner become a strong competitor? That theory just doesn’t add up. Making their own software with a familiar look and feel to their existing controllers however does.
The only reason would be so they can keep some of what they fear Pioneer is going to take anyways. The question is, why would Pioneer want to partner with Serato on this?
I don’t think it’s Serato, however software companies can and do make a lot of money selling their applications as white label software. I work for one.
Wow, too much resemblance of SDJ. If I am to look at this screen from afar, no doubt I would guess it a Serato DJ.
Surely there’s going to be a lawsuit here.
Oooh the drama. Allegedly.
I spy with my blood-shot eye the fact that it is running without being connected to any Pioneer gear.
Two tracks only?
I cannot see MIDI configuration ability…
The most recent build of Rekordbox can bring up 4 decks at a time. Also in the toolbar at the top the pic says “2deck vertical” with a drop down next to it, which lads me to believe it will be 4 deck capable, and you’ll be able to select different GUI layouts.
I might ditch Serato if full Rekordbox software comes out on iPad… Serato is really lagging on the tablet front with only Remote so far.
I’m gonna say the same thing I said in the YouTube comment section: It looks A LOT like Serato.
Actually, the effect section reminds me of Traktor, the deck section looks like Serato (obvious influence and I can’t blame them), the hotpad section looks like they made it to function like the ones on the SX, SZ, and S9, and the browser looks like it borrows from Traktor and Serato.
And I’m not even mad. I would LOVE to see the four-deck functionality of the S9 implemented to this and be able to control four decks with an S9 and two CDJ’s.
Overall I’m glad there’s another company bringing Native Instruments and Serato some competition, especially since I’m not too happy with NI’s slumber on support compared to Serato DJ.
I’m glad to see this happen. From the version they added a x-fader to the software I suspected as much. I think Pioneer might just want that extra cash they now pay to Serato with each piece of equipment sold. It’s a logical move, but they still have a loooong way to go. Trying to take on NI & Serato – espescially with DVS is gonna be a huge task. No matter what, as Dj’s we only benefit.
I don’t think we will benefit from a huge dj monopoly that is just getting bigger.
Both Serato & NI are gonna feel the pressure, coz Pioneer has the power to do serious damage. If anything, this is gonna push the dj software companies to work harder & offer more to keep existing & potential customers. I see that as a benefit.
Does it support FLAC/ALAC?
AFLAC?
Oh, look, SDJ has a new skin :)
The pads look like they are built for touchscreen, but not the other controls…
Q. Who honestly thinks this is a skinned version of Serato DJ made especially for rekordbox by Serato?
If not, Serato has a huge problem because Pioneer had made a great work (almost in skin/gui)
I don’t think so.
It’s spookily close but the waveforms don’t look the same. To look at an existing product and say “we want that but with Pioneer stamped on it” is a pretty ballsy move.
I think it’s a compliment to Serato and to how it shows they got it right. They could have copied any software GUI elements out there by all the major players and they 90% duplicate Serato’s.
A. Mark …Totally agree … some buttons and colors are identical. Fx area and playlist area in particular. Also it’s no secret that Pioneer hade Mixvibes create
Rekordbox. If Rekordbox was truly made up of Pioneers own coding they would have broken off ties with Serato with all Pio controllers. Ultimately, the laptop DJ is dying….Future controllers with have built in software and no need for computers to do the heavy work except for library management. Traktor, Numark,Gemini, Pioneer all have device with lcd screen and software running them from either on their own or computer based. Its also cheaper for manufacturers to license software than try and create themselves. Traktor is spending a fortune on R&D on hardware and software ……Apple they are not!
Which leads us to Serato making OEM versions of software not necessarily branded as Serato. We are in a transition phase where the industry is just waiting for technology pricing to become low enough that they can meet their
profit margins. Think of a Ipad mini running Traktor DJ attached to a controller…sound familiar. We are very close to lose the laptop. Manufacturers just have to get the cost to build down to $100 so they can mark it up to $500. The other question is what is Stanton going to do with Deckadance?
never say never :)
Hey Mark, I really couldn’t say without a closer look under the hood.
I want to see how the hardware configuration was left open, how you can route audio and what Pio soundcards are able to be utilized. I’ve only had my hands on NXS series for a couple days, but it almost feels as if they are using a small Unix or Linux OS off the Wolfson DAC with a Rekordbox client on it.
Like I said I’ve only had them a couple days and I am talking Recordbox, not Recordbox DJ, so it would depend on how they support it and if they can cache off a DAC. It would be cool if you could patch into a booth mounted router and run it like Recordbox.
Love how this is built to match every bit of Pioneer serato equipment, Serato must be pissed that they sponsored that playlist retreat only to highlight the S9, soon to become the flagship rekordbox mixer!
My guess: Pioneer, instead of burning money, time and customers in developing their own DVS software, made a deal with Serato and got their own, exclusive, version of SDJ rebadged as Rekordbox. This version will only work with Pioneer gear, nothing else.
From this point of view, it looks like a win-win situation. Pioneer gets their own, exclusive (and probably on steroids) version of a highly popural DVS platform, which will help them sell even more units now. Serato gets the extra revenue from an otherwise closed market, while they keep also SDJ out in the wild without a third major competitor against them.
Not a bad tactic for both companies, if it holds.
But Pioneer has the ressources to do their own thing and while they have the ideal partner with Serato at the moment they have to fear Serato doing their own controllers / hardware and locking Pioneer out. (the hardcore version of what NI did, as Serato is not at all open to all midi controllers)
Like this Pioneer takes the lead and they can keep on building their rekordbox dj monopoly. Sad but true, but this is probably the beginning of the end of Serato as a company!
Even though Pioneer has the resources (no doubt) it doesn’t mean they can pull it all by the themselves. Just look at the PLX turntable. They copied the mk2 and still got half of it wrong (especially the feedback protection). If you equate this to a very complicate piece of software like SDJ/Traktor, a LOT can go wrong. And for the level and industry reputation of this magnitude, they don’t have the option of trial & error. It would make much more sense to license a tailor made version of a highly successful software.
Also, I don’t see Serato dropping their own hardware anywhere soon. Such a business move would require a major investment & expansion, with no guaranteed results. And they are still in the middle of the SSL / SDJ switch, which is still a very bold move.
So, for the next couple seasons, this (hypothetical) partnership would make sense for both.
They didn’t copy anything with the PLX. Those turntables (re loop, etc) are all made by the same OEM company. They are just branded differently.
reloop spin 2 ?
Pioneer is getting into the software game. This spells big trouble for Serato because Pioneer was one of their biggest integrators. But it makes perfect sense. In fact, all of the design elements make sense too. This isn’t a reskinned SDJ, this is a reskinned Rekordbox. And in 2 years, after the SX and SZ are deprecated, and the newest versions and designs hit, we’re going to see Rekordbox shift to a different design competely. Right now it needs to match Serato, because that’s how their hardware is designed. But in a few years that won’t matter anymore.
And now Serato needs to dig deeper into its partners. They will begin relying more on InMusic, and looking for more higher end partners (Denon, perhaps?). They aren’t dead or anything, but if Pioneer can become a completely self-contained entity (DVS is inevitable) then they have a stranglehold on the perceptions of DJ consumers.
I havent thought of it in the light you just mentioned. That the GUI is the way it is because of the way the controller / serato dj landscape is shaped. I for one cant wait to see where this leads… (crawls back to Beta testing RKBX4)
Without the software sales / comission they receive with every sold pioneer controller Serato will have a big big problem. I can just hope that they will be able to secure some good partnerships with other hardware manufacturers. The Pioneer monopoly game just got worse!
I agree. One of the big problems that Serato is going to have is that there are less players in the game, and it’s very difficult to differentiate their equipment. Numark is an exception to that, but it doesn’t take a psychic to realize that the only market InMusic is not in right now is the DJ software game.
Hey Jared, I have a feeling that InMusic may surprise people with DJ software at some point in the near future. We have to remember that one of those companies under that umbrella is M-Audio. we can say what we want and snicker at the name, but Torq was more than just a blip on the radar for a while. It ran pretty close with final scratch for a while and just recently lost support with 2. I can see the kernel being revamped and the program repackaged, I can’t see InMusic wasting the code for it… just my opinion.
As for Pioneer, in the last week I’ve had an eye opener. Updated my Pio’s and the wrong order came in. Best mistake ever, but I digress. At his point it feels as Pioneer needs to put a bit more support and research into their new products and features. I would like to see some literature on Pioneer tested WiFi routers and network config. I can’t but help but think that there are people out there getting frustrated by this. I, myself have bought a router that causes drop outs from one deck to another due to the network switch before finding a good one… and I have a Net. Eng. degree. I feel bad for club owners and the general consumer trying to attempt it. With better support in these areas I can see services like Kuvo taking off.
As far as InMusic goes, I have to agree with you. Only because it just makes sense, right? They have their hands in almost every phase of the pro-audio market now, and adding lighting in, the last pieces are video and DJ software. Well, that and they need a DAW worth a damn cause the MPC software was not, the last time I used it.
The loss of Torq was hard, and we have all been hoping for something to come back, but that would then dissect the market more. How would that impact Serato? NI, Pioneer and InMusic (guessing Numark) would all be tied between software and hardware, and Serato would rely upon external manufacturers. It would definitely change the dynamic they’ve benefited from for years. But it can also make it even harder for smaller manufacturers to get their products into DJs hands.
Pioneer is going to need to drastically change their placement of resources. One of the major things that killed Final Scratch was terrible support. Stanton sent you to NI, NI sent you to Stanton, and in the end the consumer lost. Pioneer is going to need to heavily invest in support for their products, 100%. As far as the networking goes, I definitely am not a technological wizard, but we should figure out some ways to test this and figure out the best solution. If you are interested in some work hit me up. Maybe we can get a piece together.
Sorry, Mobo in my Internet and repair box died. Just installing essentials right now and I’m on mobile before the rebuild is ready.
InMusic surprised me with the MPC software, it didn’t make sense to me that they didn’t cooperate with Avid to create either an MPC template for Pro Tools or revamp. it with a “groove box mode” akin to session view in Ableton.
I also feel that the DJ software market is fairly diverse. Of course the top 2 being Traktor and Serato, but I feel as if Mixvibe is a reasonable contender with its familiar Rekordbox looking skin and it’s 64 bit forward thinking support. Pioneer; as I’m finding out with my new 2000s; is its own experience in conjuction with Rekordbox. I’m finding the the preformance features the are build into the decks allow for a bit of creativity, but not as much as Traktor.
As far as Pioneers support… agreed. They need to cater to the consumer. After all, the consumer has purchasing power and in the end it turns into profit margin. Let me get back to you about networking, I’d like to get my studio box/home server/work pig running again… only about 8 hrs of installing left.
The MPC software surprised me as well. It felt like it was designed by people who had focused on designing for the small MPC screen and just decided to increase it and give it some color. It didn’t allow tags for samples, and just felt incomplete.
The industry is very diverse and there are choices, but those choices are hampered by poor hardware integration and incomplete MIDI spec (I say this as one of the few people who care about it). I really want to like MixVibes Cross, and there are a lot of really nice things about it. Rekordbox is going to jump into the stratosphere, and we really can’t discount the importance or popularity of VDJ. In the club scene it may be looked down on, but the mobile market has embraced it, and some of its features are really important.
We should discuss networking stuff. I’m barely aware of it but am more than willing to learn so we can begin figuring out best practices for clubs and users. :) Let me know when you can set some time aside.
Torq still haunts my DJ dreams at night. Worst piece of software EVER!
after the SX and SZ are deprecated??? can you elaborate please?
In two years, we will be up to the SX-3 or 4, right? But then rekordbox will have come into its own as a competing software and, if pioneer is smart, it won’t resemble Serato at all. They may even move to a new naming convention, and the current crop of hardware will be considered old and out of date.
Pioneer might be able to put together software that is at least as good as Serato but they have a way to go to build up brand loyalty with respect to software. Serato have a very responsive and knowlegeable customer services/forum set-up and a lot of DJs have been with them for over 10 years – this is sometimes worth more than pure financial muscle. Does anyone have a handle on Pioneer’s share of the controller market..?
i blame this on serato, keeps moving forward without fixing issues. fix your problems THEN add new features. i suppose its too late now, rip serato, maybe numark will save you
Have you reported your issues to Serato? They seem pretty quick to me at fixing anything they know about.
They’ve known about the AMX problems for at least 2 updates now.
I have invested so much time and resources with my Virtual DJ library that I don’t see myself ever making a full transition to any other software any time soon. I recently started playing with Serato DJ and Live and although my tracks are all scanned, doing all those crates, cue points and loops is not on my mind right now.
Down here in this country, Serato is the king of pro DJs software, Virtual DJ (home and/or cracked) is the newbies and me-too-I-wanna-be-a-dj software and Traktor, well, for the daring few (I have only seen two guys use Traktor). Maybe over time I might transition to Serato, but I don’t think any other software will ever grab my attention fully.
It is good to see all these new softwares in dev every now and then; the choice is very wide and we are spoilt for choice.
If only someone would work on something to take your entire collection back and forth between any program out there…
And if only that someone would ship the damn thing already :)
That’s a great idea. Actually two great ideas. ;)
And I am pretty sure a whole load of people have the same dilemma.
I don’t know much about computers and programming and stuff, but I have always thought that since VDJ’s data is saved in .xml format, is it really that hard to convert to some other DJ-software friendly format?
It’s actually trickier than it seems. First because not all programs use XML and second because even if they did they all have their own kookiness (technical term) that you have to deal with.
On top of that, if you want to sync between them and not just convert then it’s a whole other layer of fun on top of it.
I had a little brain storm, more like a drizzle… Is there any way to repackage Rekordbuddy with a binary translator to run it as a windows client? My Hackintosh died and I’m pretty happy with Win these days.
i jump between RBX and Traktor, RBX on big clubs and Traktor on private parties and venues with cramped space!
Not sure if anyone has mentioned this yet as all the chat seems to be about DVS…surely with the new deck pad functions in the software this means new CDJ2000 players are imminent???
Pioneer has maintained a product life cycle of 3 years (at the longest) for their top-of-the-range CDJs since the introduction of the CDJ-1000s. The CDJ-2000nxs have been introduced in september 2012. It’s about time for the next generation :-)
I heard a rumor that it is coming this fall…with a touch screen like the XDJ…
Hope it is not a touch screen…you can’t beat physical buttons, particularly on actual hardware! Had a go on the XDJ 1000 and it felt cheap to me and not very user friendly….
you want to beat, buy a drumkit and hook it up to the cdjs
CDJ2000 has became an standard on all the clubs around the world… is an continuous, unquestionable and very mature market …. the flagship products like this one, have a lot installed base and the sales target will bet for the people, clubs etc. renew the old CDJ with the incoming new… they cannot expect a fresh wild sales new market like what is happening on the controllers….. so, the question is.. what will be offer the new CDJ2000 (beside touch screen) in order the stimulate the people to refresh the controller?….. will be interesting…. Personally I think that the product will not be disruptive, because the models works and as Technics years ago, I bet will be a renew beside a new product…
Well if they birth a MPC with a CDJ2000 i jump ship, we are djs not producers and if i want to smash on drumpads i buy a roland or as said a MPC, but thats what im guessing at, and if thats the case, i’ll but a pair of lowpriced Nexus as they gets dumped
Noope its for the S9
i hope they make 2 versions, cause i dont need this christmastree, i now i ever would get a S9. i dont understand what all people are raving about. DJM 909, period, you dont need anything else.