Worxmas was fantastic. We seemed to strike the right chord with everyone, and achieved the desired result i.e. intelligent commenting from a lot of engaged people, something that we want to build upon. Much of that of course will be down to us creating the right content that encourages quality commenting. But before we start on this, I feel the need to address an increase in less than ideal commenting and interaction between community members.
When you’re on DJWORX, you need to think of it as being invited into our house, where good manners are expected. We don’t expect you to agree with everything that we or others write. But before invoking keyboard warrior mode, just remember that you are all invited guests, and we expect you to treat us and others with politeness and common courtesy.
You may feel the need to spew a stream on insults and expletives into the comments box, but before you do, take a step back and think about how you would feel if someone did the same to you. Is calling someone a retard the best way to explain your point? Do you think that trolling someone is an effective way to contribute to the DJ scene? We don’t, and it stops today.
So instead of unconstructive full caps insults, why not rephrase it with “I disagree and here’s why”. I know that if someone called me a prick and simply told me I was wrong, I’d switch off and probably never read a comment from them again. But calmly explaining why they thought I was wrong is guaranteed to get me to read and respond too. Hell, we don’t claim to know everything and actively encourage conversation where we and everyone else can learn something new, or have our misconceptions or outright mistakes corrected.
So for those who come here just to flame — don’t. The days of tolerating bad community members are over. If you were in my house and upsetting my other guests unnecessarily, you’d be asked to leave. So if we have to lose those people whose sole aim is to disrupt or cause offense, then we’ll happily say goodbye to them for the greater good. We only want community members who are actively interested in helping push things forward for us and the DJ world. Like everything else we do, it’s all about quality. I trust I have been quite clear.
Welcome to DJWORX. The industry is watching and taking notes, so make a valuable contribution.
Countless times I’ve come across amiable discussion with other DJWORX members. Besides the interesting articles, it’s one of the reasons I keep coming back. Nothing motivates and stimulates the soul like an engaging conversation with people that are interested in the same things as you. Cheers!
Here here!!
Good shout!
Good words Mark. No hating from me. Ever. I promise.
trolls are just that trolls, its like they get paid per insult. we love ((((Djworx))) !
I guess the VDJ thread caused quite some stir, didn’t it? Anyhow, I fully agree with this instruction. If we are going to have heated discussions, at least we can keep it on a grown man’s level. Acting like teenagers will only drive people away.
It’s not just that – it’s been building for a while now. But I have drawn the line now. I’ll unlock the VDJ comments again and hope that intelligent commenting can prevail.
Indeed. To be honest, I’ve noticed lately a lot of heat building up in the DJ world, in quite a few different levels & areas. Maybe that New slaves routine did a lot more than everybody initially thought, lol!
I’m not used to commenting very often because disqus used to have an issue with me logging in because I have 3rd party cookies disabled on all my browsers. It was a bit of a hassle for me. But I just checked and it appears to be working fine now. Yay!
Anyways, that being said I AM used to reading comments on here and I do appreciate the (most of the time) civil thread etiquette that most users seem to have.
And I’m glad it is easier for me to comment no, you’ll probably be seeing more of me soon.
Excellent. Disqus is useful, but I’m not the biggest fan for a few reasons.
I think the big question is, is this really mark kinchen???
Thanks and excuse me to feed the troll… I just was searching how to block someone at discuss and continue living peacefully.
When you argue with idiots, they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. Ignoring them usually works best ;)
Word. Try to remember everyday… or just start flame those mothe…!!!
Ommmmmmmmmmmmm…
;)
Winning flamewars doesn’t give me any sort of satisfaction anymore. It’s like, “yay, you pwned a stranger on the intarwebz using a clever arrangement of words – here’s your gold star and a cookie”. Nobody cares. A high-level conversation, however? I might just learn something I didn’t know. Of course, I’m not a saint, so when I *know* I’m right, I will defend my position. But this can be done in a civilized way. When you want to be respected, show respect yourself :)
Sure! I was just kidding… I was tempted by some insulta but at last it passed away… ;)
Did you recieved my message at soundcloud?
It was a shame the VDJ thread got locked cause I was enjoying my conversation with Tony Mitchell. But, well, that’s how these things go. Stuff just gets ruined by the internet.
Regardless, I’ve had some great discussions on DJWORX in the last few months regarding defining DJs, software, hardware, etc. As rough as it gets at times, we shouldn’t lose sight of how positive it has been.
It’s open again now. A bit of breathing space will hopefully calm everyone down. Or I may jump in there and call you out for being you.
“Stuff just gets ruined by the internet” nicking that :)
Outside of just a few instances, I have always enjoyed the commenting here. It is really one of the few websites where comments don’t immediately descend into vitriol. I was pretty bummed to see the vdj thread, but really, that was not the norm here. I think too many people were just sad not to win anything sweet from worxmass, :D
Anyway, thanks for being proactive in keeping your community so positive. It really makes a difference, even to lurkers like myself.
Good shout Mark, i love a good tear up online as much as anyone as long as it well natured, it gets a bit silly when people just resort to slating others and content with no valid reason as to why.
the community on here is generally great though, i always see it as a kind of vibe like its the Helpful people from the Serato forums discussing DJ stuff
all this just for us? we feel flattered
I don’t post here a lot and guess I was busy with Algoriddim during this chaos. Me personal I try to stay as professinal as possiable (well until someone calls me cheap or a liar, which all happened recently on the Algoriddim fourm) … Needless to say though I ignored that person and got the discount I was after from Algoriddim for DJ Pro. Which I guess then made said person even more upset. anyway goes to show if you feel like something isn’t right speak up or don’t complain later. Now I’m off to find this vdj discussion sounds like a interesting read. Yes the industry is watching so be intelligent with your statements regardless if they are postive or negitive. But as far as djworx goes this is a wonderful site and yall give quality information. I have been reading for about 5 years now
Good post Mark, even though I fear some or all of it may have been directed at me, and for that I am eternally sorry. Could I suggest something to improve matters though? It seems that internet anonymity makes the trolls feel they can say anything to anyone, therefore can you switch of guest accounts and make people only comment with accountable profiles? If I say something to someone, they know who I am, where I live and what I do, I can’t and don’t want to hide.
And again, I really do apologise for calling out you know who .. he just got my goat, It’s no excuse I know, and at my age I really should know better.
Mark Stewart
Proud reader of DJWORX.
Personally, I wouldn’t comment at all if I couldn’t remain anonymous or at least have a private username. I am quite protective about not using my real name (or photo) on the internet. Having said that, I always attempt to conduct myself in an appropriate manner.
Why do you feel the need to hide? Honest question, not trolling.
why you feel you the need to expose yourself to strangers? i never was interested in your age or status but you seemed happy to share irrelevant stuff
my advise to you is dont take the net so serious, there are more important issues irl to be concerned about
So you are still here, the question wasn’t directed at you but still you feel the need to answer.
The next time you write something, check your grammar.
Mark, sorry mate you’ve lost a reader.
awww dont be so sensitive, man up and play some vinyl
I understand where you’re coming from, but it’s a shame to lose a solid contributor.
Mark is right to be annoyed. And that’s why we’re taking the steps to eliminate poor community behavior. I’m certain Mark will still visit, and with any luck we’ll write things that make him want to comment again, regardless of who else is still here.
No problem. I like to keep my life compartmentalised and try to prevent adding anything personal to the somewhat permanent www.
I’ve often thought that if you have something to say, you should do it under your own name and be accountable. But I understand those who don’t wish to give out that level of personal information and respect the decision. You’d be surprised who comments here, but can only do so under an alias for a number of reasons.
So a consistent alias is fine, as Disqus offers a lot of control to us as admins to manage members. I would hope that me drawing a line in the sand will be enough to deter the small minority of people who only wish to cause trouble.
Clever Graphic, nicely done. well handled issue, better than my attempts in the vdj thread. writing “troll” adds nothing to any discussion. in all fairness, the commenter in the vdj thread, did say imo clearly what they disliked about the demo. that is why I felt it necessary to defend their right to say it. from my own personal experience as a reviewer, I had given up on there being a place where someone could say anything negative about these products we are interested in. yet, many of the reviews of late have openly embraced a stark honesty about the gear being reviewed. I’m continually impressed by the integrity of this site, and grateful for it’s existence.
Thanks Steve. People can be negative if they want, but it’s about putting it across properly. “That shit is wack and those guys are toys” is not constructive. Saying “it would have had more impact if they’d used more experienced DJs” delivers a stronger yet encouraging message but without insults.
The stark honesty you speak of — expect more.
agreed. that IS out of line. (I saw “toys” and assumed it was some euro super scratcher, and gave it more leeway than it deserved)
i have a graffiti background so im used to speaking of toys and kings from being a teenager, lets put it this way, in the early days biters would get dissed, it seems nowaydays everybody in rap and dj is ok with biters, i should have said “i wish they were more original” not to upset some ppl
Your background may be the reason for your behavior, but it is not an excuse. When you interact with people online, you’re interacting with people who come from all kinds of different backgrounds; expecting everyone to approach things from your perspective is juvenile and extremely unrealistic.
On the topic of your perception of the increased acceptance of “biting” (copying/imitation), it seems to me that as hip-hop culture ages, it is also maturing. With over thirty years of history at this point, pretty much every scratch, rhyme, break dance move, or graffiti piece is in some way influenced by those that came before it. The culture can’t survive without new people joining, and people who are new to an activity tend to be bad at it. If every newbie or amateur is insulted until they reach a level of expertise that self-appointed cultural guardians deem appropriate, the culture will wither and die from lack of new members.
Thanks Mark,
This was my Worxmas wish answer. Let’s be positive or when criticism is needed at least constructive. Keep this amazing website…….Amazing.
Commendable and best of luck to you, Mark! We actually took the very hard decision to “lock down” our comments to our members only for 2015 rather than allowing quick commenting via Facebook, Twitter IDs etc, for precisely the reasons you outlined (and also because we got bored deleting ignorant / obnoxious comments from people we wouldn’t even want to be in a room with – why not just lock the door?). I wish you luck policing your overwhelmingly positive, authoritative and respected community.
@ Mark Settle / Gizmo
This article was created to address some of the behavior on the virtual dj web spotlight article . But you never addressed the points about the audio content of the video’s you choose to feature.
Here are some examples..
November 10, 2014 …VirtualDJ 8 DVS — scratching at the top table?
December 18, 2014 Frisk Fader demo from DJ RelyT
January 2, 2015 Atomix Power Room — VirtualDJ’s web spotlight
January 7, 2015 Two guys, one deck — Fong Fong and Mart One
I could find many more like this.. But i would just be repeating myself .. See i politely made a comment about the same issues in 2009.. Dj Worx quoted my comment & created a strawman article to attack me. But they never contacted me to engage & i didn’t see the flaming article until last year.
http://www.djworx.com/skratchworx/newspage.php?fn_mode=comments&fn_id=1259
I empathize with Cutselekta.. Scratch Dj’s need to stop using the same limited palette of sounds in their uploads as it’s boring , unoriginal & embarrasing.
You have Djs with a dvs system who can access or create any sound from any genre , any decade & any source but all this is ignored in favour of kyaa & fresh..
I no longer bother commenting or contributing to the forum as there’s a lack of objectivity…It makes no difference how you articulate yourself..As many in the dj community are ignorant of the culture & artform.
Bulletpointing:
1. The entire point of this particular article was to address the emerging negative tone over the last year. The VDJ piece was simply another example that brought it to a head, especially when we’re focussed on building a community of intelligent articulate commenters, who can make a point without reverting to insults.
2. The initial comments in the VDJ video missed the point. It was not a video about boundary pushing or showcasing next level skills, but was all about presenting VDJ’s new abilities in the best possible way, and that is via classic sounds that everyone can relate to.
3. I wrote that article five years ago now to directly address your mail. It was neither a straw man piece, and neither flamed or attacked, but simply disagreed with the same strength of feeling that you used when you wrote to me.
I believed then as I do now that the classic sounds are the benchmark by which to judge the ability of a DJ, and the gold standard sounds by which to test the scratchability of DJ gear. They are used by every scratch DJ at all levels to show off skills, and especially suitable for use in demo videos.
We are a site dedicated to DJ technology, and will post any video that we feel fulfils this primary criteria. And I’m very confident when I say that most demo videos will continue to use these sounds, both from the DJ scene and any we choose to make ourselves. Should we not have posted the Fong Fong one just because it has some sounds we recognise? What about the jaw-dropping skill? I feel that I’m skilled enough to demonstrate scratching on new tech, but it’s not my remit to push the art form forward. That’s for the like likes of Fong Fong, and they seem happy to continue using those sounds and demonstrate amazing skills when they do.
Do you think that turntablism is being held back by the use of a couple of sounds? Would turntablism be magically propelled forward by use of sounds that we’d never heard before? That has been happening for years, and still the classics prevail. The issues are more deep rooted than that. I’d say the focus on battling being the face of the scratch scene with its rules and regulations is a key part of the problem.
If you want a website that’s purely pushing the art form of scratching forward, then you need to look at a more focussed turntablist scene site, because that is not DJWORX. I think however that you’ll just find more videos using the classic sounds, because ultimately that’s what scratch DJs like to use, including every single VIP scratch DJ.
@ Mark Settle / Gizmo…
This is what Cutselekta wrote..
QUOTE
” these so called DJs are straight up toys, bad scratching going on and even worse they all use the same aahh wich is getting really unoriginal,if they want turntablism to be more popular then CHANGE YOUR GAME and be more original, and that applies for promo vids too. The prob couldnt find talent to do that vid ”
But you wrote this 4 days ago on this very page ..
QUOTE.
“Thanks Steve. People can be negative if they want, but it’s about
putting it across properly. “That shit is wack and those guys are toys” is not constructive. Saying “it would have had more impact if they’d used more experienced DJs” delivers a stronger yet encouraging message but without insults.
The stark honesty you speak of — expect more. ”
Movin on..
It’s not my business to dictate what you should feature in your articles. But do we really need another online video with the same homogenized sounds? I just posted 4 earlier examples from November – Jan but i could easily find many more.
Are you really surprised to hear valid comments from Cutselekta. When you set the tone with your articles.
I thought Cutselekta’s comments were directed at Atomix / Virtual Dj who should have exercised some quality control.. But i feel it struck a nerve as i think there are many in the community who would have done the same demonstration …And i felt that he was being attacked & misquoted.
I’m only posting because i feel that Cutselekta needed some support. As his comment highlights many issues which are not being addressed.
Expanding .
Take a listen to the non English language speaking entrants at the Dmc World finals or eliminations .. Your more likely to hear the same stock sounds rather than the local cultural ethnic sounds which are representative of the nations & countries.
How can this be possible with digital vinyl systems? What a wasted opportunity!
Many of the online video routines are not even live..As many dj’s are just miming over edited audio.
The issues also run deeper than the Turntablism scene .As you can find many examples of the kyaa & fresh stock sample scratching in video games. E.G …Saints Row: The third & the Wwe wrestling games.
I’m not looking for anything i just expect fairness & objectivity rather than a witch hunt or imposition against an alternate view.
Surely it’s not what you use, it’s what you can do with it?
@Steelsberg. I don’t understand your comment & it’s context. Can you please expand ?
Hearing someone do something basic with familiar ingredients is pretty uninspiring, however hearing somebody do something new and clever with the same ingredients is cool. The ‘2 guys, 1 cut’ video you cite is a good example, as are some of the Ida scratch battle entries.